New permanent magnet motor on youtube from Roobert33

[billmehess]

But what if you now enhance the cap filling by using exciter/joule thief/captret techniques? Maybe then the cap will have enough to get past the sticky point.

Again if you will build one of these motors you will see what it will take to push the rotor past the sticky point. In under one revolution there is not enough speed or torque to generate but a very small amount of energy. A pulse motor will employ a electromagnet. The generated energy will
barely engage the eletromagnet. Not enough to do anything.

[Pirate88179]

Bill:

I agree totally with everything you have said thus far.  In looking at Jesus's design, why not think about using a supercap...something with a lot more boost to it?

Of course you are right in that the first 90% rotation will not be enough to charge much of anything BUT, who cares?  If the rotor was similar to one of my Bedini motors that used a vcr head complete to get a really nice flywheel effect, and one were to really give it a good initial spin (input energy) that might be enough to juice the supercap just enough to apply small pules perfectly timed to keep the system going, maybe not forever but possibly quite a long time.

I don't know.  I was not surprised when this designer came out and said it was a fake, but as mentioned if we can use our knowledge of pulse motors and JT circuits and supercaps, we might, just might have something new.

Jesus:

Very good thinking over there.

Bill

[Omnibus]

Hi Omni

Yes I have built quite a number of magnetic motors. The problem with them is that they have very lttle torque in their first ( and subsequent revolutions) At the most in a cap, and I usually use a 4900mf cap. you will see usually  well under 100mv generated and stored in the cap. As we all know you have only the first revolution to be able to provide the necessary work to get past the sticky spot.
Any type of  pulse system will require a lot more stored energy than that to push the rotor past the sticky spot. Also employing a cam system will not work. I have tried many of these. Again when the
stator hits the cam it will cog the system. These cad programs always show them operating so smothly but in reality this is not the case.
I believe a magnetic motor is only possible when viewed as a hybrid system. Where there is some kind of external input that will cause the rotor to "jump". This with multiple revolutions "maybe" might be able to store enough energy in a cap system to in effect rewind the system.
I am sure you remember when I was working with the 30 day wind up clock mechinism. I have taken
the clock motor which will run for 30 day or 43200 minutes. With the pendulum holding a 2" in diameter N-45 magnet it will give me the necessary in and out swing to act on a rotor assembly.
I have been able to get more than one revolution numerous times but so far not more than 1.75 complete revoltions. The timing must be exact so that the stator magnet moves in just at the right time to engage the rotor magnet array. If this can be accomplished then this unit would have a very long time to store energy in a cap. array. Enough to rewind the clock mech. mayvbe? I don't know yet.
Manually the clock mech. takes 12 seconds to rewind. So would it be worth it to store 43,200 min. of generated energy with only having to manually rewind it . I don't know that either. I'll keep playing around and see what developes.
Any one actually trying to build a magnetic motor will see the reasons why it will not work on it's own.

I see. This has to be studied more carefully, though. Remember Paul Sprain's motor? Too bad he had to remove all the vids and references after the advice of his lawyers. Indeed, it wasn't self-sustaining but had a great potential in that respect. Don't know what happened further with it, unfortunately.

As for these motors with the positive feedback such as the one at hand as well as Torbay's and maybe @xpenzif's there's no clear theoretical grounds to judge one way or the other because works of different character are being done and, as is known already, at certain conditions violation of CoE can occur. In the current case it very well may be that the magnetic potential energy at the start is less than the overall energy at the minimum where the cam kicks in and that may be enough to lift the lever and prepare the system for a new beginning. That was the principle of Torbay's motor which I still think is a viable, although very difficult to tune up, construction. The current one seems less complicated in this respect (who knows?). One lesson learned from Torbay motor is that one shouldn't use those super strong neos. Notice how delicate this system is -- not only using iron pieces rather than neos but the drum itself is light and delicate. Wonder where I can find such a cup. I'm getting tomorrow the 64 iron pieces from the machinist and am gonna ask him to make a 100mm dia solid drum of 60mm height made of plastic. This is what I'm gonna start with despite what I said about the device being delicate. Just to try and see what the flywheel effect will be (and also because at present I don't have a thin-walled copper drum). Also, I couldn't find the magnet with the rectangular shape used as stator on top. Instead I'll use four cylindrical magnets of 15mm length and 2mm diameter magnetized through the length. Will let you know how it progresses until I'm here in Europe. If I can't finish it will have to repeat the whole thing all over again in the states because I don't want to carry with me suspicious pieces of something through all kinds of airports.

[billmehess]

Bill:

I agree totally with everything you have said thus far.  In looking at Jesus's design, why not think about using a supercap...something with a lot more boost to it?

Of course you are right in that the first 90% rotation will not be enough to charge much of anything BUT, who cares?  If the rotor was similar to one of my Bedini motors that used a vcr head complete to get a really nice flywheel effect, and one were to really give it a good initial spin (input energy) that might be enough to juice the supercap just enough to apply small pusles perfectly timed to keep the system going, maybe not forever but possibly quite a long time.

I don't know.  I was not surprised when this designer came out and said it was a fake, but as mentioned if we can use our knowledge of pulse motors and JT circuits and supercaps, we might, just might have something new.

Jesus:

Very good thinking over there.

Bill

Sorry but a super cap will absolutely not work. It would be impossible ( I hate that word) to generate enough energy to charge a cap let alone a super cap to do anything in one revolution or should I day in less than one revolution.
Hi Omni
Regarding Paul Sprains device it was predicated to work by having a electromagnet pulsing the rotor thru the sticky spot. Again with less than one revolution not enough energy can be generated to do this. To increase somehow the torque to generate more energy in a cap system on ly increase the strength of the sticky spot. At this point its a mystery.

[woopy]

my 2 more cents


laurent

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SAUHrVyKJ1k