Measuring INPUT Power Accurately and with no Oscilloscope

[poynt99]

Skeptics and those that question, are most often criticized for being close-minded, ignorant of nature's true ways, and for dismissing things out of hand.

I would suggest that arguing against this proposed method before and without even trying it, is clear evidence that the "proponents" can be accused of the aforementioned just as well.

.99

[Rosemary Ainslie]

Skeptics and those that question, are most often criticized for being close-minded, ignorant of nature's true ways, and for dismissing things out of hand.

Not sure what you're answering here.  I'm certainly not a sceptic.  Are you?  I'm happy that an average is a valid number - but it does not relate to an accurate power analysis.  That's always based on vi dt.  But you know this.  You had a whole thread dedicated to just this debate.  Lawrence's numbers were suspect because they were averaged.  For some reason our numbers are suspect because they're not averaged.  it's like I say.  Retrospectively you can argue just about any view point and from any vantage - and you do.  It would be so nice if you'd just stick to one argument.  Quite apart from which - I think you'd need to take up cudgels with the entire academic and mainstream community if you want to propose averaging power as a valid measurement on a switched circuit.  I think it's only applicable to currents that are NOT switched. 

I would suggest that arguing against this proposed method before and without even trying it, is clear evidence that the "proponents" can be accused of the aforementioned just as well.

Poynty - if one averages the current where the mean average is negative - then, even there one is left with COP INFINITY.  It's not to enhance the argument that I'm reommending instantaneous integral analysis.  It's because that's what's required - by mainstream - more or less for the reason that I've exposed - albeit with those rather generalised examples.  it's the best I could manage.  We both know how limited is my knowledge and my intellect.    

Rosemary

[poynt99]

For those interested in knowing the truth about the circuits they are working with, I would hope that you can appreciate the ramifications of achieving accurate INPUT power measurements. I would also expect you can see the simplicity and elegance of this proposed method, and that if proven to be effective and accurate, it is applicable for use in any such circuit which uses a DC supply source, no matter what.

That the wave form across the CSR is mostly negative, positive, or a mix, is irrelevant to the viability of this method. The simulation has proven that, and what needs to be tried is the application to an actual switching circuit.

Disregard any such references to the technically-nonsensical babble as seen in recent posts here. It is irrelevant to the discussion, and flat denial of the method without even trying it is evidence to suggest that it is not desired that the truth be revealed. Disregard also the nonsense about not understanding the posts; that is only to detract from the topic at hand.

I will be posting some results by the end of this weekend, if time permits. Granted, real evidence as to the efficacy of this method should be provided, and I will try my best to do so.

.99

[hartiberlin]

@Poynt
how did you MEASURE the
red waveform ( current at shunt )
in the
multi-fet-wave09.gif
file ?

What kind of multimeter did you use,
that can cope with these extreme spikes in realtime
or did you use an additional low pass filter  ?

Or is this just from your simulation ?

As I said, simulations might not show the real truth here
cause there might be effects here at play, that are not yet programmed
into the simulator.

As pulsed circuits can use the battery energy much better than
DC circuits you might get from a fully charge 100 amphour battery
with such a circuit an output energy of 150 amphours,
so these circuits could be really 150 % efficient...
But the ou energy then comes from within the battery delivering
more energy and not from the circuit.

Regards, Stefan.

[poynt99]

Stefan,

So far I've shown only the simulation results.

Regarding battery OU effects, how exactly do they manifest?

If it is a current going back into the battery, then the resulting power calculation will be the opposite sign of what is expected, and this measurement method will detect that.

.99

@Stefan; I'd prefer to keep this thread locked until I am able to post the results of my tests showing actual results, hopefully in support of the method being proposed here. Thanks.