Hydro Differential pressure exchange over unity system.

[TinselKoala]

TK, it looks like mrwayne has answered those questions in his post, and corrected me saying that it did not run over night.  So oher then what we see in the video, I don't know of any statements of observed run times.

I think if you are interested enough; and confident enough with the claims and what information there is in this discussion and patent application; you could be the first one to build a continuously self-running, working ZED demonstration model to stop the BS,  -and when you send it to mrwayne for examination, he will give you a prize of $10,000  Or you could shoot for the $5,000 prize.

You can't be serious. What if what I build doesn't run? I could be holding my mouth wrong, I could be using the wrong color water.... I could have a 60 thousand dollar torque wrench problem.
Besides, my PerPump is already just as continuously running as anything we've seen. Do you not think I could make it run overnight, before it springs a leak or runs out of water, by giving it very large, elevated reservoirs that I am allowed to precharge?
I don't want MrWayne's money, at all, and at this point I wouldn't take it if he offered it to me. And there is no way that I'd take thousands of dollars for a bunch of glued together discarded plastic packaging, anyway. If he wants to give away money so badly, let him give it to his local no-kill animal shelter or spay-neuter program, in the name of Eureka Archimedes.

His challenge is in Reply #1552 on: August 20, 2012, 11:47:07 PM, and he says you don't even have to beat his team who are switching gears to build one. 

or...

patiently wait and see if the movie comes out; produced by Mark Dansie.

Enjoy.

Yes, thank you, I have seen that. Pretty funny. Even if his team makes the first selfpowered water pump using zeds as specified, he will still award the money to another independent team that makes one later.  Quite an incentive, isn't it? To me it means that his team doesn't have now and has never yet had a small working model of their operating principle, and they are hoping someone will help them develop it. I've noted that 10,000 dollars is very cheap for such a device. If I had one it would be worth a million, instantly, and a billion by the end of 2012, and onwards from there.

And as far as waiting for the movie... I note your use of the word "IF".   

Let me ask YOU something, there, MIdone, since you seem to be a talker and MrWayne has probably put me on his ignore list.
If YOU had a device that really truly overturned physics, thermodynamics, and engineering principles and created energy out of "nothing", even at the low excess rate of 36 Watts..... how exactly would you handle getting it to market, getting it "validated" or confirmed?

Wouldn't you be worried about the people that go around blowing up laboratories and stealing notebooks and prototypes, the MIBs who assassinated Nikola Tesla and stole his notes, the Big Oil people who have a great stake in keeping things as they are, the Mossad, who are known to steal what they want that might be of military significance, the people who "rifle" computers at a distance to steal data and images...... the Agents of Suppression of Free Energy, in other words? Moray, Tesla, Meyers, Papp... there are literally hundreds of cases in the literature of suppression of free energy technologies, and many of them weren't nearly as good as what MrWayne's got. By discussing it here on this forum.... aren't you practically sending out invitations?

So I've just got to wonder.... why are we discussing this here at all? Why isn't Mr Wayne sequestered in his very own laboratory at Boeing or LLNL, working for our Government on this project that has clear national security implications?

I mean... I certainly got YOUR message: you want ME to stop discussing it here.

[GreenHiker]

@midone - welcome to the group - I'm a newbie too.
Great posts.
Careful how you feed the bears; cute, cuddly and VERY creative - but they bite 

Yes, welcome MIDone! Good to see more newbies!

Wild animals are unpredictable and may bite the hand that tries to feed them.

[MIdone]

Tk, you seem to be taking this ZED discussion seriously.
I have been observing it, and kind of just testing the waters now by repeating things already stated in this discussion to see the reaction.  My suggestion to you was not completely serious, because I knew by your logic displayed here you probably wouldn't start building one.  It was a bit facetious.
At the same time, I tried to point out things mrwayne already had answered that you may not have read.

At the beginning of this discussion mrwayne said several times that he was not here to prove his machine was overunity, (in his own mind he just knows it is, because of whatever he and his team decided).  I believe he said he was here just to show this effect he named, and how it is used in his machine.  He has done that, but has not proved overunity with the information presented.  He wants people to take his word that it's overunity, and build it. 
What's makes a person decide to do that without mrwayne showing a working one, and wave that important aspect by???...he convinced them, maybe by just repeating that it's clearly overunity enough that some want to believe.  Some are convinced, because he presents himself as being convinced.  There's that mystery of 'what if?'
This is what rings the bell to a lot of us as being an illogical reason, because the reality of hard evidence has not been presented.  There are extraordinary claims, but we have not be presented the proof.

I may be wrong; but technically, I don't recall mrwayne himself ever saying that he has a continuousely self-running, *WORKING* ZED that demonstrates overunity. To him, he is sure at times something has worked.  He was working on getting it working; for Mark Dansie to really dig in and test.  He said he could get it working because it was just mechanical problems.  Assured people that he could get it working because it was just mechanical problems.  Has plenty of money to get it working; but that wasn't working.  Old ZED isn't doing what ZED's are suppose to do.

I also stated a serious common sense observation that should make a rational person still question this stuff, that no one has seemed to pick up on.  Accept maybe you just now.  -This change of gears because Old ZED has got some Gremlins.

What I stated in my first post that should be obvious and now very clear to people; is that right now mrwayne does not have a working machine that can demonstrate overunity.  If he did, he would not be now shifting gears to build a working machine to demonstrate overunity, to end what he calls BS -in his post, (TK, I was just repeating what he thinks is BS).  Or trying to get someone in this discussion to build one for him, to send him to demonstrate overunity, for a prize of $10k.  This really shows a sign of reaching out, to get out of a mess.

In my mind, as an inventor, this is what you would do yourself.  Before you spend tens of thousands on a building size machine. Before you file for a patent on it.
What happened here, is what is called 'jumping the gun'.

I don't want to aggravate people by stating these things anymore.  If people want to experiment, it's no problem to me.  Something will always be learned.
If someone builds something that actually works that Mark Dansie is waiting to really test, great.  Something caught this professional skeptics attention.

So enjoy.

Thanks for the welcome guys, and as I said before I'm just making some observations.

[parisd]

TK: Never claimed that, you misread me. I beleive Travis effect is a piston effect so pressure should be higher. I read it was equal and was surprised of that.

@parisd: Are we sure that the air pressure is the same in both cups? I've suggested connecting them with a thin tube at the tops, to make sure that they are, and see if the Travis Effect persists. Has anyone done this little experiment?

[TinselKoala]

@webby: You think you've got problems... I have to unscrew the jars and pour out the water, to start mine over !
But in your case, I thought that was what the second unit was supposed to do... as the first one reached top dead center, or maybe just before, the second one starts mashing back down on the first one to drive it back to the start state. So the second one's cycle starts halfway thru the first one's cycle. For my PerPump it's a matter of keeping the input and output flows constant so that the floater doesn't hit the stop but is dynamically stable halfway up. It's not a cycling system but more like balancing on a basketball.


@MIdone: Thanks for the explanation. I'm not sure, though, that MrWayne has avoided making the direct claims, though. Until yesterday I thought the thing had been observed to operate for days... that is the impression I got, somehow, from the statements that have been made by various people. The specific fly in the ointment that you've pointed out... yes, I've thought that too, from the instant the news was out. I am reminded very strongly of Steorn, Orbo and the SKDB cult-club trying to solve McCarthy's problem for him.
But in spite of all this I still believe that MrWayne himself is sincere..... but mistaken, perhaps a little self-deluded, or perhaps even himself the mark in a long con being played by someone else.

It's clear to me that they have excellent technical assistance.... the welding is great, the hydraulics and pneumatics all look great, all of that very professionally and expensively done by people who knew what they were doing. But some of the problems that have been reported, and the lumbering, groaning, uneven operation of the machines we have been shown indicate a certain lack of ... something, I don't know what.... at the design level just above the actual construction of the machine. This sixty thousand dollar overtorque issue is a case in point, although I don't have enough detail to be able to evaluate just what happened and how to prevent, say, an innocent replicator from having the same problem.

@seamus 10n: I do believe that the Wright brothers flew many kites and tethered gliders, even invented the wind tunnel to test models during the years that they were developing their silly invention. They even soared, in unpowered gliders, making sustained flights in the updrafts at Kill Devil Hill, and learned how to fly and how to control their airframes. Only after they had lots of success with kites, wind tunnel models, tethered gliders, and actual soaring gliders, did they finally hang a motor and some propellers on their best glider design and exhibit it to the world.

Exactly backwards from the present case, it seems.