Was Bessler for real?

[onepower]

Here's a clue about Bessler...
https://orffyre.tripod.com/id16.html
Bessler history, a good read

young Orffyreus was an exceptional student of such things as science, mathematics, languages, and mechanics.  Among his many skills, he knew how to build clocks, watches, mills, and organs. He also understood smelting and casting. Like Leonardo Da Vinci, he seems to have been a man of many talents, and studied theology, medicine and painting as well as mechanics.

In my opinion this is exactly the kind of person who has the skills and ability to discover something new, a genius.

Think of the skills of a clockmaker,
-all the parts need to be precision made and efficient as possible
-all the masses and motions of countless parts fully understood
-countless parts perfectly timed and synchronized with each other

These are exactly the skills and understanding one would need to build the kind of device in question. I would bet nobody here has these skills or even knows someone with them. You think your smart and skilled?, then build me a watch on par with a Rolex from scratch. This is the level of knowledge and expertise Bessler had which may explain why he could do what he supposedly did.

However we do not need to be a genius like Bessler nor possess all his understanding. Bessler did all the hard work and left us many clues on how to proceed.

I found it's much easier to break everything down into first principals and simplify what was said.
1)The device uses the "motion" of "weights" acting on "mechanical parts" like springs, gears and levers.
2)The well known concept of equal and opposite action/reaction dictates that there can be no conventional gain in energy.
3)Ergo, the only option left is a change in the properties of some element within the system.
4)Under what circumstances could a system property change or appear to change?.

Most think this is impossible but it's not that difficult. Suppose we had a weight at the perimeter of the wheel. Then a trigger activated a spring which flung the weight into the air inside the wheel to some other part of the wheel. For as long as that weight is airborne and not touching the wheel it has left the system and cannot act on any part of the wheel. For all purposes the weight has completely disappeared until it comes to rest somewhere else after a time period. Now if one spring expands throwing the weight into the air and when it lands it compresses another spring the energy can be conserved. Here we can see we could make a weight periodically disappear from the system and the loss would be very small. This is only one of countless way to periodically hide a property like weight or mass within a system.

AC

[stivep]

Bessler was hunting nonsense -in terms of today science.
Nonsense has very little lack for any discovery.
These committed to the doable not to the nonsense
must have distinctive  education or  be autodidacts or be just very lucky.
For every upside, there's a downside.
Misfortune - unfortunate or distressing result  is not what you want Dear onepower.
Any activity in any place Bessler had, should  make you aware  that:
- Entertainment  ends when you need to buy some flowers to your girlfriend and than support your future family needs.
We may agree or disagree but my risk of valuable examination, is lesser in the eyes of the educated in this art crowd
and you are trying to exercise a "revolutionist" who lost or who lost big time.
-Intelligent, gifted, but  moving in the  wrong direction.
Wesley

[onepower]

stivep

Bessler was hunting nonsense -in terms of today science.

Yes I got that the first time my Russian troll, after the N'th time it only made you look like an imbecile. As if repeating something over and over and over somehow makes it more true, it doesn't.

Back to the actual topic of this thread, I have a theory about what Bessler may have been doing...

Like any new or advanced technology, even those we currently know of, the premise must rely on some element few ever considered. For example, many people said you cannot fly because your too heavy. Then someone invented an airplane which could fly. It is true that people cannot fly, but they can ride in an airplane which can fly. It's a matter of perspective...

In effect, we should not be looking for an effect most people would have thought of but the last thing they ever would have considered. This is why another brilliant inventor by the name of Victor Schaberger implied we should always do the opposite of what everyone else is doing. I mean, if what were doing is not producing the desired results then why keep doing it?. Why not try to change?, what have you got to lose and what to gain?. Mix it up, try something new...

I don't know, maybe as an Engineer raised on the farm I'm a little rough around the edges. So when someone claims I cannot do something my first instinct is to tell them to go fuck themselves and the horse they rode in on. I will decide what I can and cannot do not some nit wit who hasn't even tried...

AC

[stivep]

//many people said you cannot fly because your too heavy. Then someone invented an airplane which could fly. //
I don't know, maybe as an Engineer raised on the farm I'm a little rough around the edges. So when someone claims I cannot do something my first instinct is to tell them to go fuck themselves and the horse they rode in on. I will decide what I can and cannot do not some nit wit who hasn't even tried...
AC

You have valid point with airplane.
Bird was first , human, replicated  observable phenomena.
No conflict with science was ever present.

- and yes - you decide.. true statement , no questions.
To find the way around you need to find how to fly in perpetual motion area
as a first human in history of human kind...
I do not think it is possible.
Wesley

[TommeyReed]

Hi All,

One thing that really gets me is claims that is over 10 years on this forum.

Has anyone try building a prototype on this forum?

It seem like a Howard Johnson Motor that can be duplicated.

If nobody has try to duplicate this theory, I would be willing to take a jab at building one.

Tom