Has anyone seen Lasersabers new motor runs on 1000uf cap

[JouleSeeker]

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Do you know how the "dancing-flower circuit" works? If there are four wires leading from the flat coil to the circuit, a trigger coil might be in use?

In the video only one coil drives the rotor, which is interesting. I am not convinced that more coils are necessarily better than fewer coils (with a higher DC resistance).
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Greetings, Conrad ....

Greetings, Conrad - yes, sewing needles work great as bearing AND as the axle (as in my little vid, above)

Re: function of the "dancing flower", just 2 wires to the coil.  Slider wrote to me (and said its no secret):

In a dancing flower, the coil sits on a base and is glued to it. To remove the coil, it's safest and easiest to bend the plastics down either side of it with pliers, such that the glue breaks and the coil can be lifted away. The 'petals' are on a hinge, with a dangling piece of plastic that has some weight and a small neo mounted inside. The neo is pushed each time the coil fires and produces a pendulum type swing to and fro.
All i've done, is to convert each firing to 360 degree rotation, by having the 4 magnets on the rotor.
2 magnets on opposites sides work, but it doesn't always self start.

Using a DC PS, I found that the speed of the rotor depends on the VOLTAGE; for example, at 0.65 V (close to the minimum for it to run), the rotor likes to spin at about 98 RPM.  Faster with higher voltage - but don't go too high or you'll burn out the circuit. 

Also, the motor (and the nearby driven-rotor) will spin at integer-multiples of the fundamental, as one might expect - depending on how fast you spin the rotor to get it started.  If you let the motor self-start, it chooses the lowest omega = angular velocity.

Next I'm going to the DadHav circuit/motor -- and I think the Lasersaber motor is very intriguing also!

[SkyWatcher123]

Hi folks, thought of another type of use for long high ohm coils.
For example, a three stage motor coil setup could be used.
Where we have one main coil set used to power a motor, then a second set of coils with same mass, higher ohms, can be powered from a capacitor, using the flyback from the main drive coils.
Then a third set of coils with same mass, even higher ohm coils, can be powered from a capacitor, using the flyback from the second set of coils.
Capacitors would be sized at proper voltage and capacity, to give additional coil stages good pulse strength and the capacitor size being able to maintain the coil load without depleting under the main input voltage.
This setup would be similar to the mechanical analogue of pulley ratios, to use the higher voltage/low current (higher speed/lower torque) of the flyback, to convert into a more usable form.
peace love light
tyson

[Farmhand]

Unfortunately I can't check the current of my Earth battery because the copper tube got removed and the hole filled in, it must have got in somebody's way, bummer.
Anyway we all know how it works and about the power available in most cases.

The thing with the really high DC resistance coils is that as the power of the motor is increased by raising the voltage or whatever to drive a reasonable load then the power dissipated in the resistance of the coils would become significant.

All the high power motors that I've looked at that can run varying loads and are most efficient with a full load all have low resistance coils and it's for a good reason I think.

As well i don't think many of us have the equipment or skill to measure very low power accurately enough to make any claims. uW power devices can be very efficient because of the minute amount of current at play, Fact of the matter is that the load possible for the motor is directly related to the maximum power of the motor.

A spinning rotor has energy for sure but it isn't a useful output unless it is used for a useful purpose to do work. The very least load would be a no touch rotating timing device as a use for a spinning rotor
(effectively no load but it is being used) efficiency is then at play. If the rotor is serving no purpose the output is nil and so there is no efficiency at all.

Conrad, to get to higher speeds wind resistance will be a factor as well, uA power devices are also restricted by wind resistance. Try taking a uA power motor with 9000 Ohms motor coil resistance up to 4000 rpm and see how hot the coils get because of how much the input multiplies to do it and the massive DC resistance.

Basically if a light rotor takes a fair while to spin up at full power the motor has very little usable shaft power. All things being equal it does take more than double the energy to run the rotor at double the speed because of increased wind resistance mainly. Just like a fan, the load caused by a fan as it speeds up is not linear, it takes a lot more energy to take a fan from say 2200 to 2300 rpm than it does to go from 300 rpm to 400 rpm. Lot's more. If the speed is continuously raised for a fan eventually it will cause cavitation and possibly the resistance caused by more speed will even off or even drop, but so will the air moved.

Work cannot be performed without energy being used to do it.

Cheers

P.S. I think the real question we should ask ourselves is. Do we think this device or a device like it can produce more output than we input to make it work ? Considering the DC resistance of the circuit I would be inclined to say, I don't think so.

If anyone could maybe explain how they think it might be possible by using less and less power, or why going this route would give more chance than any other or any chance of producing "more out than in" I would appreciate the insight.

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[Pirate88179]

Oh I meant to say that an Earth battery would run LaserSabers motor for free a few times over I think.

I have two dissimilar stakes driven in the ground about 0.5 meter and 2 meters apart one is copper tube the other is a galvanized steel picket. They would last for years, and is scrap metal.
I get at times up to 900 mV with some short circuit current which I don't have equipment to measure properly and don't remember the measurement I got last time but I could try to check, I'll need to find a better meter, I might use the uA meter I have set up as a field strength indicator, I'll just need to disassemble it, i'll try with a multimeter first if I can find a suitable one.

Cheers

It should do it easily.  I have run my Bedini motor from mine.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rauOlhNK0iY

This was from an output of just 2 volts.  I did not make any of the JohnnyDavro modifications for efficiency at the time of this video.

Bill

[wattsup]

Also posted at @lasersabers web site.

@ Wattsup

I may remake the project in 123D Design because it is important to me that people be able to access the design files freely.

I may put the older versions on eBay with a starting bid price to just cover the materials cost.  I may end up with a lot of these motors before I finalize the design.

@LaserSaber

I really don't want to overburden you by suggesting you should migrate the design to 123D. Best you spend your time on more crucial matters. Forget about eBay when you have @wattsupbay right here ready to buy any one of your present models just to get my hands dirty, uh wet, uh busy, uh you know what I mean.

An easy test.........

Find a very small standard transformer (or one you have made yourself) and put the primary in series on one or the other side of the reed and see what you can get from the secondary. Then feed back the secondary to the holding cap. Maybe rectify the secondary with a germanium diode so the cap does not unload itself into the secondary. This would be a first trial in looping some energy back to the source capacitor without relying on the actual existing system.

If you want to get it working even harder use a second reed on top of the first reed and connect the transformer primary between the reeds so all three are in series (reed-transformer primary-reed) so that the primary gets completely disconnected from both sides when the reeds are open. See the effect.

When you apply any power source to a coiling system, does not matter how it is driven, if only one side of the coil is a breaking point, the other side of the coil is still permanently biased to the source polarity so the change in the coil is never complete. Is is only complete when both coil ends are completely disconnected that the coil re-biases itself to the only field left........to the Earth field, just  like your compass will bounce back to north (or south) when you remove a magnet. This may provide some added energy source but only if the coil is completely off the source from both sides. Sounds simplistic but I have found this to be very true.

The problem arises when such a scheme is tried with mosfets or transistors, the above condition can never be 100% true as it can be with a physical reed break. You can even try a second reed without a transformer and just put that second reed on the other side of your series coils and see the effect.

wattsup