Evaporation Driven Self-Sustaining System

[Nink]

In my simple example we could use a test strip on a pendulum and when the test strips curl this changes the balance point of the mass of the pendulum not unlike pumping a swing.

Hi AC,

I appreciate your explanation although  I am not sure how this will actually work. 
1) The rate of expansion is a lot slower than in the video, if you read the white paper you will see it has been sped up so there is no significant recoil effect.  At best I believe you will only change the center of balance of the pendulum and not invoke a swinging momentum.  Once expanded the spores will still be directly above the source of humidity so they would not contract or curl.
2) The expanded spores have a greater surface area then the contracted spores. As a result they will be exposed to a larger amount of water vapor so I do not  believe they would contract until the source of humidity is removed.
3) The mass of the spores is directly proportional to the rate of expansion. The longer the strips the larger the spores so the greater the mass that has to be moved in order for the pendulum to swing.

You have also proposed several other ideas and concepts that I believe require an additional level of detail to sufficiently understand them. It would be beneficial if you choose one of your ideas, provide additional detail and draw a diagram to explain how you believe it will work.

Please don't interpret my comments as negative. There is a lot of value in solving this problem and perhaps you have some insight on how to solve it.  If we could solve the unbalanced wheel problem through humidity and apply it to a wheel the size of say London Eye you could generate a significant amount of power.   Like you I have some ideas on how to leverage these spores to generate power but I need to give them further consideration to fully understand how they could work. I usually start with a 2D drawing => 3D model => Physics Simulation and finally prototype.

[allcanadian]

@Nink

Please don't interpret my comments as negative. There is a lot of value in solving this problem and perhaps you have some insight on how to solve it.

I don't think your comments are any more critical than mine and would agree there are many problems which need to be resolved. The first is that the rate of change, response time and magnitude of work (FxD) are low implying low energy density. However if we attached the start of one strip to the end of the other in a series configuration not unlike a spring... one turn connected to the other. Then we have a greater force over a greater distance and a differential response time over the length. Now it seems obvious that if the singular turns of many "springs" were interconnected then we end up with a three dimensional form not unlike a sponge or honeycomb.




The issue many have is being overly preoccupied with the motion of a single strip however this is not how nature works. Nature always uses multiple working elements acting in unison but still remaining independent in themselves. A trait we as humans have trouble with and this translates to our perception thus how we build technology. Nanotechnology or engineered materials is changing our perceptions and now "small is big". Thus while big test strips are a losing proposition billions of small ones compacted into a functional 3D form is obviously a winner. A single transistor is not a computer or intelligent however billions of them etched onto a chip are intelligent. One thing multiplied may become something much more than the sum of it's parts... this is how nature works and it is also how we work. We cannot judge a technology based on the singular any more than we can judge a person based on a few cells found in their liver. We are more than the sum of our parts and so if we want to move forward and progress our technology must also move in this direction.




Regards
AC

[gravityblock]

I appreciate your explanation although  I am not sure how this will actually work. 

1) The rate of expansion is a lot slower than in the video, if you read the white paper you will see it has been sped up so there is no significant recoil effect.  At best I believe you will only change the center of balance of the pendulum and not invoke a swinging momentum.  Once expanded the spores will still be directly above the source of humidity so they would not contract or curl.

Number 1 above is more misdirection by you.  The rate of expansion/contraction for the moisture mill and the oscillatory engine with LED experiments are in real time as shown by the video itself (snapshots of the video below for quick reference).  The lift test and the oscillatory engine w/o LED were shown at 2x.  You can't take the information for 1 experiment in the white paper and apply it too all of the experiments in the video.  What is wrong with you?  You continue to be deceitful and to misrepresent the facts at every turn!  Either way, we can clearly see a significant recoil in the moisture mill and the oscillatory engine LED experiments in real time.  The rotational speed of the moisture mill in the video, which was shown in real time is proof of a significant recoil effect.  Also, when the moisture mill was placed under a load while it was operating as a car, the motion on a few occasions slowed to a stop.  However, the spores has more time to absorb the moisture on the humid side of the wheel at a slower RPM, and has more time to release their moisture content on the lighter side of the wheel, which causes a further increase in the mass imbalance of the wheel to increase the torque allowing the moisture mill and the car to once again rotate and move, which shows a significant recoil effect.

Increasing the diameter of the moisture mill gives the spores more time to absorb humidity and more time to release it's moisture content.  For example, let's say a 6ft. diameter wheel rotating at 50 RPM's gives the spores enough time to become fully saturated with moisture and gives the spores enough time to fully release their moisture content.  This allows the spores to fully expand and to fully contract in order to have the highest mass imbalance and maximum recoil effect.  Now, with this in mind, we can add more spore strips by increasing the width of the moisture mill.   Each spore strip has an additional weight attached it, which causes a greater mass imbalance of the wheel.  We'll increase the width of the moisture mill so it will still rotate at 50 RPM's under maximum load.  This gives us the greatest mass imbalance of the wheel and the highest amount of torque available to the system when it's operating under maximum load without decreasing below 50 RPM's.   We can then attach the moisture mill to a generator with a 1:100 gear ratio, and the generator will rotate at 5,000 RPM's under maximum load while having maximum torque available to it.

Gravock

[gravityblock]

Increasing the diameter of the moisture mill gives the spores more time to absorb humidity and more time to release it's moisture content.  For example, let's say a 6ft. diameter wheel rotating at 50 RPM's gives the spores enough time to become fully saturated with moisture and gives the spores enough time to fully release their moisture content.  This allows the spores to fully expand and to fully contract in order to have the highest mass imbalance and maximum recoil effect.  Now, with this in mind, we can add more spore strips by increasing the width of the moisture mill.   We'll increase the width of the moisture mill so it will still rotate at 50 RPM's under maximum load.  This gives us the greatest mass imbalance of the wheel and the highest amount of torque available to the system when it's operating under maximum load without decreasing below 50 RPM's.   We can then attach the moisture mill to a generator with a 1:100 gear ratio, and the generator will rotate at 5,000 RPM's under maximum load while having maximum torque available to it.

Gravock

We could have one set of heavy weights being lifted by the spores expanding and contracting while another set of heavy weights are slowing falling as they turn a generator.  Once again, determine what our maximum load will be, then design the system accordingly.  This will give us the height of the lift/drop, how much weight will be needed, the gear ratios, and how many layers of spores (muscles) will be needed in order to operate under maximum load while having maximum torque available to it.  A few harmonic drives would be the best to obtain the high gear ratios.

Reference (video)

Gravock

[gravityblock]

This simple humidity-driven generator is built out of Legos™, a miniature fan, a magnet, and a spore-coated cantilever. As the cantilever flips back and forth in response to moisture, it drives a rotating magnet that produces electricity.  A device built on similar principles could function as a humidity-driven electrical generator. Credit: Xi Chen/Columbia University.

The spores expanding and contracting in a properly devised contraption can be used to get past the sticky point, lift a weight, or be used to trigger a huge imbalance in all kinds of gravity wheels, etc.  The possibilities are endless!.

Gravock