Study of Generator Coil Acceleration Under Load (moderated)

[gotoluc]

 This was posted on my youtube video and though of posting it here as it is the way I see the effect at this time.

Posted by deslomeslager    3 hours ago 
First of all: nice build as usual! And thank you for sharing. I watched it with pleasure, and hope to see the next one soon. I think of the rod as a piece of elastic band. And the prime mover as an up-down shifting device as an analogy). The coil is the 'closed end'  for the standing waves. As you move the coil you are actually shortening the piece of elastic band (or cord, perhaps it should not be elastic at all). I hope the analogy stands for a bit. What it does not explain or what is not in proportion is about the phase shift. There will be a point where the emf will help rotating the prime mover. On the other hand, if the closed end of  a cord is changed in an open end, the amplitude can go to twice it's maximum value since there is a returning wave which adds up. Is this a bad comparison?

My reply:
I'm thinking of the core more like water. The magnet flux, like a wave on the water. The wave is first created by the magnets movement which moves through the core like a wave on water. The coil represent an obstacle to the wave. So if it's close to the beginning of the core the coil reflects the wave back to the magnet which happens to be the same pole the wave was created causing a braking effect to the magnets movement (Lenz Law). Now move the coil back far enough on the core and by the time the wave hits the coil and reflected back to the magnet, the magnet may have had enough time to rotate to the next pole (opposite) which will cause an attraction (acceleration) which is the reverse of Lenz.
As for why different coils cause different result is caused by the coils time constant (charge time) which will dictate on how much time it take for the wave to be reflected back the magnet.

Also, another variable is, If the coil is under load at the same time, this will dictate on how much of the waves force will be reflected back to the magnet, hence reducing its capability of assisting.

I would tend to think the most efficient energy transfer (using this effect) would be to adjust it so the time constant and load completely absorbs the wave and nothing is returned which will cause no lost in magnet movement and no gain.
Now, to say there are no losses to the magnets movement would not be completely correct, as we know Eddy currents in water cause losses and are also present in the core material. However,  using the newest technology in thin core material will alleviate much of these losses.

Hope this helps.

Luc

[Magluvin]

When I read Lucs posts last night it all reminded me of Romeros thread. 

Glad to see you chime in Romereo.   

Its good to see this come back to life.

Going to shop to build some things. 


Mags

[plengo]

mh,


could you create such a timing diagram that you mentioned to the best of YOUR knowledge of what is happening in this video? I would love to see your comment in a way that builds constructively.


Fausto.

It simply doesn't work like that and there is no "magnification process" taking place.  Plus the language being used does not make sense, coils don't "add amperage."

Every one of these setups needs to be evaluated on a case by case basis.  There is no generic "advice" on how to see a rotor increase in speed when the configuration is changed.

And "configuration is changed" is the key phrase.  I make a change to my system by adding a load.  Therefore there are two configurations to analyze, without the load and with the load.  All off the voltages and currents need to be measured and a complete power audit has to be done for each configuration, never forgetting to account for the waste heat.  Countless times experimenters have been thrown off and they confuse "increased output" for what is really less waste heat.

If you really want to understand a setup then you should construct a timing diagram with as much information as possible incorporated in the timing diagram.  All of the answers explaining the how and why and when of the setup are revealed in the timing diagram.

[Magluvin]

The best way is to maintain the same speed under load while the power generated is of a considerable amount.

Well said.  Getting output current 'without' affecting the speed of the driven rotor. Meaning that you get output without loading the rotor motion, thus not an increase in input to the rotor.


Mags

[Magluvin]

Just a week or so ago I had posted that I went and read some of the beginning of the Muller Dynamo thread where Romero was putting his motor together. And I said it was still inspiring. Well today makes it even more. 

Been playin with my motor setup and fiddling with magnet biasing the core to reduce cogging and it works well. Depending in the core used, magnet used and distances adjusted.  Was just getting into rearranging those as the pickup coil is loaded. So it doesnt have to be a long core with a sliding coil to find the same effect. Just sayin there is more than one way to skin that cat, as Romero had shown some time ago.



Mags