Rene/Meissner EMF Higher Voltage Charger Variant

[SkyWatcher123]

Hi gyulasun, thanks for the reply.
Yes, i will do that if needed.

I finished a test at 25 volts using similar input and the efficiency came to 102.8%.
This test was with the top coil flipped the other way around.
I will flip the coil back the other way and make another test at 25 volts input, though first i will check magnetic field polarity.
peace love light

[SkyWatcher123]

Hi all, have been making more tests.
Just finished another charge/load test and afterwards I checked the magnetic polarity of the separate coils in series, using a 12 volt battery, briefly applying power.

In this latest test, the coils were in repulsion and yet, the efficiency has increased to 104.5% at 20 volt input again.

Part of the reason for the increase, may be because I flipped the bottom coil, because more copper was on one end compared to the other, as can be seen in the picture posted.
This may be giving greater inductive coupling.

Still, it is interesting that the efficiency is higher with bucking coils in this type of configuration.
Thoughts welcome.
peace love light

Also, I made a previous test and i did not have the ferrite tube cores touching each other, from the two coil cores and the efficiency was normal, at around 100%.
So it seems, the two coils need to be sufficiently coupled, inductively.

[gyulasun]

Hi SkyWatcher,

It is interesting that with the coils in bucking connection you get a bit higher efficiency. Yet, conventionally it can be explained I think: due to the big coil sizes involved, the magnetic coupling cannot be so strong between them and this is valid both for the bucking and the aiding cases of their flux.

To understand this better, if one of the coils were wound directly on top of the other onto the same bobbin (say you had one fat coil) and you would connect them also in bucking series, then the resulting L inductance would be much less than it is when they are bucking in the one coil placed above the other position as shown in your present picture.
And in the series aiding connection (now I refer again to the example of wound directly on top of the other on a single bobbin), the resulting L inductance would be even higher than in the series aiding position when one coil is placed above the other as they are shown in your picture. 

Unfortunately, the truth on the resulting L inductance for the two coils in any series configuration could be answered more precisely by an L meter.

Remember that when you removed a certain amount of wire from the 12 strand coil recently and its earlier L inductance surely got reduced, you managed to obtain very nearly the similar 102-103% by some tweaking in the circuit like the efficiency was with the original 12 strand wire length.  i.e. did you have to tinker with the circuit in the bucking coils case your picture shows?

You may also ponder on whether you explored the several possibilies of filling the 12 strand coil back then with varying length of the toroidal core inserts, i.e. changing the L inductance of it by the length of the core. If yes and in case you found a broad range for the peak efficiency, then it is possible that the reduced inductance the bucking coils cause (when they are placed as your picture shows) may still fall into that broad range and with some tweeking the circuit that good result came about.

You wrote: "Part of the reason for the increase, may be because I flipped the bottom coil, because more copper was on one end compared to the other, as can be seen in the picture posted. This may be giving greater inductive coupling."

I respect your tending towards 'the more copper higher efficiency' idea, trying to explain the better efficiency result. Please consider also what I tried to mention above.
I do not think that the "more copper was on one end compared to the other" is what influences efficiency, especially if you had to do adjustments in the circuit in the bucking mode to arrive at the better result.
If the cores position are considered when flipping the coils (if they can be considered without measuring inductance) then the resulting L inductance has to be within close range for the flipped case i.e. magnetic coupling should be also within close range so efficiency-wise this could not count as much.  This is what I think.
Thanks for sharing your work.
Gyula

[SkyWatcher123]

Hi gyulasun, thanks as always for your very helpful replies, I appreciate your help very much.

And I'm sorry if I am causing any confusion, though most of those previous results were in error.

The results I have gathered with this new meter, are pretty accurate in my opinion.
The 10awg. coil/core on its own, showed 94.7% load test efficiency.
The 12 strand coil/core on its own, showed 100.1% load test efficiency.
So the interesting thing at this time, is the fact that the coils in series combination, with one on top of the other, is giving the above COP 1 results.
Well yes, the circuit is altered, because i went back to 20 volt input, so maybe that is why the increase in efficiency.

Though the question at hand, is this, why is this setup going over COP 1 now, where before, with just the single coil/cores by themselves, they could not achieve this.

I'm currently trying to find information on a device I remember reading about from Bill Muller.
It was a solid state overunity RLC circuit and if i remember correctly, it had a similar configuration, a coil on top of another coil, though I don't remember if it was bucking or not, i will find it.
peace love light

[gyulasun]

Hi SkyWatcher,

Okay, and the dilemma now is: how do you know that if you could make the inductance of the 12 strand coil to have the same inductance that now the bucking coils have, then what efficiency would you get? Pondered on that?
The bucking coils inductance can be either higher or lower than the 12 strand coil has.   

Gyula