Wireless energy transfer experiments ,Builders board

[gotoluc]

I did the DC test but the situation is the same for AC.

https://youtu.be/6t-WbWIqwhY

Of course, all devices correctly measure the 4ohm resistor

Hi r2fpl,

Using a multimeter is not the ideal way to measure actual resistance between grounding rods. It only give an estimate of the grounds conductivity. There are more specialized instrument for doing this which transmits and receives a signal, then computes the resistance.

@gotoluc
you could maybe just spray down the ground with a hose ... 2k Ohm, that's really high.  Thanks for measuring.

Yes d3x0r, I agree but the point of the test was to demonstrate how bad of a conductor the ground is in my area.
This was a reply to poynt99 post, suggesting the currents return path is completed through the ground by coupling of Tesla coils top capacitance.

Electronic engineering states that, to deliver current there must be a return path (example: 2 wires)
So as far as an EE is concerned, it is not possible to transfer power using only one wire, there must be a return path somewhere.
I personally don't agree the ground can be considered as the return path in my area anyways and why I made this demonstration.
I have already demonstrated it's not done through the air by enclosing the receiver in a Faraday cage. So it's still unclear how this simple circuit can transfer power using only one wire at distances of 15 meters or more as demonstrated by this video r2fpl has found. 

Link to 15 meter single wire power transfer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtG5nU34WQ0

So an EE is unable to explain how this can possibly work because the teachings have remained limited till today.
Tesla knew of this misunderstanding over 100 years ago and tried to educate by demonstrating but was cut off by the influences of the time.

Regards
Luc

[znel]

I have retested the setups using a scope and the self tuning resonance circuit stays at 1.1Mhz (TC resonant frequency) connected to wire or grounding rods.

Video demo: https://youtu.be/ISaLhHcMkVQ

Regards
Luc

I believe gyula was referring to the receiver coil changing frequency when connected to earth, in which case you may need more or less capacitance in the top load.   The sandy ground, as you mentioned, doesn't provide the mineral content between the ground pair needed for a lower resistance.   If you watered the ground around the rods, this would expand the area in which the current can flow ( instead of the small area of just the rod ) and lower resistance.    A "good" ground would be a deep ground, one that penetrated the water table where minerals and moisture is abundant.   

[gyulasun]

Hi Luc,

Thanks for checking the operating frequency for the two cases.

Let me notice the followings:

-- you pay attention to the frequency of 1.1 MHz and not to the decimals and I think that the loaded Q of the two secondary coils may remain relatively high. From your scope display the frequency is 1.147 MHz for the direct wire connection and is 1.137 MHz for the grounded pipe connection. This roughly 10 kHz change at the TX coil frequency could mean a significant detuning when we are dealing with high Q RX and TX circuits.

However, the RX coil frequency would change roughly in the same amount and direction the TX coil's frequency does when their bottom wires are grounded to the pipes so the 10 kHz change can safely be neglected indeed.
So here I assume the pipes may detune both coils in the same amount so both coils may remain closely tuned to each other as you carefully tuned them with the singly wire connection. I answer this also to member znel's comment above, it was easier to check the TX coil frequency change than that of the RX coil. The tuning on the RX coil would be the best as he has mentioned by changing the top load capacitance, and I add to use a low power LED as an indicator instead of the incandescent bulb.  But there is no real need to do this, it is sure there is a certain amount of energy transfer towards the RX coil but ground losses certainly limit it. 

-- you measure the ground's DC resistance between the pipes as 2 kOhm. Unfortunately, ground resistance (or rather) impedance is frequency dependent too.  I agree what you wrote to member r2fpl on measuring ground conductivity, it is a complex issue and conductivity may change due to change in the moisture content of the soil etc as znel mentioned.
Regarding Tesla, I think he ultimately wished to resonate the entire Earth by the magnifying transmitter for the high efficiency (over 95-96%) energy transfer and this would not involve the Earth's  conductivity in the sense his earlier coil transmitters (by single wire or via air) or your present tests would.

Gyula

I have retested the setups using a scope and the self tuning resonance circuit stays at 1.1Mhz (TC resonant frequency) connected to wire or grounding rods.

Video demo: https://youtu.be/ISaLhHcMkVQ

Regards
Luc

[lancaIV]

Hi r2fpl,

Using a multimeter is not the ideal way to measure actual resistance between grounding rods it only give an estimate of the grounds conductivity. There are more specialized instrument for doing this which transmits and receives a signal, then computes the resistance.

Yes d3x0r, I agree but the point of the test was to demonstrate how bad of a conductor the ground is in my area.
This was a reply to poynt99 post, suggesting the currents return path is completed through the ground by coupling of Tesla coils top capacitance.

STATEMENT :

Electronic engineering states that, to deliver current there must be a return path (example: 2 wires)
So as far as an EE is concerned, it is not possible to transfer power using only one wire, there must be a return path somewhere.

RELATED NON CONVENTIONAL EE-DEVICE :
https://www.google.com/search?q=avramenko+1-+wire+plug&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-m





I personally don't agree the ground can be considered as the return path in my area anyways and as demonstrated.
I have already demonstrated it's not done through the air by enclosing the receiver in a Faraday cage. So it's still unclear how this simple circuit can transfer power using only one wire at distances of 15 meters or more as demonstrated by this video r2fpl has found. 

Link to 15 meter single wire power transfer: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PtG5nU34WQ0

So an EE is unable to explain how this can possibly work because the teachings have remained limited till today.
Tesla knew of this misunderstanding over 100 years ago and tried to educate by demonstrating but was cut off by the influences of the time.

Regards
Luc

[gotoluc]

you pay attention to the frequency of 1.1 MHz and not to the decimals and I think that the loaded Q of the two secondary coils may remain relatively high. From your scope display the frequency is 1.147 MHz for the direct wire connection and is 1.137 MHz for the grounded pipe connection. This roughly 10 kHz change at the TX coil frequency could mean a significant detuning when we are dealing with high Q RX and TX circuits.

Since we are not dealing with a clean sine wave in both cases the scope averages the frequency based on the wave form shape. The very small difference in frequency the scope displays may not at all be a real change in frequency from the circuit but from a small change in the sine wave shape. Look closely at each wave shape and I'm quite sure you will see a small difference and hence the change.
I'm use to seeing these small digital artifacts affect the frequency data on a digital scope and why I ignored the digits below 1.1Mhz
I'm very confident the transmitter coil is locked at the same resonating frequency in both cases.

However, the RX coil frequency would change roughly in the same amount and direction the TX coil's frequency does when their bottom wires are grounded to the pipes so the 10 kHz change can safely be neglected indeed.

Yes, I agree.

So here I assume the pipes may detune both coils in the same amount so both coils may remain closely tuned to each other as you carefully tuned them with the singly wire connection. I answer this also to member znel's comment above, it was easier to check the TX coil frequency change than that of the RX coil. The tuning on the RX coil would be the best as he has mentioned by changing the top load capacitance, and I add to use a low power LED as an indicator instead of the incandescent bulb.  But there is no real need to do this, it is sure there is a certain amount of energy transfer towards the RX coil but ground losses certainly limit it. 

The point of the experiment was to consider the ground (in my area) as a possible current return path. So to reduce load and retune should not be necessary but I do understand why it's mentioned.

you measure the ground's DC resistance between the pipes as 2 kOhm. Unfortunately, ground resistance (or rather) impedance is frequency dependent too.  I agree what you wrote to member r2fpl on measuring ground conductivity, it is a complex issue and conductivity may change due to change in the moisture content of the soil etc as znel mentioned.

Yes, I agree, ground impedance needs a special instrument to measure.

I made a video demo of such an Instrument I have access to: https://youtu.be/kCwCf20l6FM

Regarding Tesla, I think he ultimately wished to resonate the entire Earth by the magnifying transmitter for the high efficiency (over 95-96%) energy transfer and this would not involve the Earth's  conductivity in the sense his earlier coil transmitters (by single wire or via air) or your present tests would.

Yes, again, totally agree. Tesla wanted to offer mankind much more then just the AC Grid.
I also agree that ground conductivity was not how Tesla's ultimate technology worked.
I'm only playing with this as a starting point but interestingly enough, just this one wire power transmission is enough to rattle the present EE beliefs.
The magnifying transmitter is beyond belief.

Regards
Luc