Muller Dynamo

[hartiberlin]

there won't be 15V on the output, obviously  (even without lamp load) in this circuit, because the diode will clamp the o/p to be approx Vbattery + 0.7V

Yes, but image for a moment you would not yet connect the recovery diode.
Then you would have 15 Volt at the rectifier output and the battery would
have maybe 12.20 Volts.
Then when you connect the recovery diode, the voltage on the battery should rise,
as the output now charges only the battery back.
But the voltage of the battery is falling.
So what is going on there ?

[khabe]

you need to ask Lidmotor that question - he is getting >2V when combining two bridges with only approx 1.8V each

see my quote from Romero above (although obviously you've already seen it when you read through the whole thread) for the change between individual bridge o/p (approx 11.5V DC) to the final combined o/p from 7 bridges (15V DC)

does that answer your question?

Yes, nul, we all know about pm generators that first thing what uplifts output voltage is rectifier and second what acts for is Capacitor but never met before that two paralleled dc sources give double voltage ...  perhaps question is about top most peaks and current?  When side by side peaks then for result comes sufficient width of for multimeter
cheers,
khabe

[nul-points]

@bourne: Very nice thinking and very clear demonstration. The systematic nature of the "travelling occultations" depending on the number of magnets (on the rotor) and the number of coils (on the stators) and the direction of the apparent movement of the "occultations" (with the rotor movement or against it) is a very important insight.

Question: Does the direction of the occultations (with the rotor movement or against it) have any real effect?
Answer (just a speculation): Since the coils (their cores) attract the magnets, the occultations should move with the rotor in order to assist its rotation.

Greetings, Conrad

hi Conrad

these are good questions - wish we had more of these!

bourne was good enough to share these insights into a possible 'travelling magnetic wave' with in this kind of odd/even coil/mag config and a few of us have discussed some possibilities together with him
(we pictured it as a kind of 'Mexican Wave' travelling around the stator)

i wouldn't say that we have any solid answers yet

bourne pointed out that the 'wave' would rotate either 'with' or 'against' the rotor direction depending on the ratio conditions

we don't have enough real data of a full rotor/stator interaction yet - only Romero's video demonstration of the net result!

so we can't be sure yet if there IS a physical outcome of this 'wave' - it's possible that it is only a kind of 'optical illusion', like the 'Moiré Pattern' effect, say

at first, i thought that the wave ought to travel 'with' the rotor, to be of benefit - but now i'm thinking that since magnetic induction occurs as a result of rate of change, then maybe it doesn't matter so much which direction the 'wave' travels

bourne's analysis has shown that this 'wave' rotates in different directions in Romero's device compared to (at least one of) Muller's - yet they bothreport overunity results

we tend to think mechanically, and say "in order to assist, it MUST travel WITH" - but - IF this is an ELECTRICAL benefit, not a mechanical one, then it may just be additive to the sum o/p, rather than be contributing to the 'motor' effect driving the rotor

ie. the 'unexpected' action might be in the generator, rather than the motor
(dayyum, i think neptune just won his bet!!! LOL)

i hope i'm making some kind of sense here?

wrt your other question, about increasing the number of 'occultations' - if you mean this 'travelling wave', then my initial feeling is that there is always just ONE such 'wave', regardless of the coil/mag ratio

bourne's analysis is showing that altering the ratio can change the rotation direction - and also possibly the 'sharpness' (like 'Q' graph?) of the wave profile

[EDIT: iirc bourne also showed that the rotational 'speed' of the 'wave', relative to the rotor, is proportional to the number of magnets;
it travels 'faster' than the rotor, in the same way that a water-skier zig-zags with faster surface speed than the speed-boat pulling it]

hope this helps
np

[2nd EDIT: i hope i've given a fair review of bourne's analysis, and our subsequent 'small-group' discussions with neptune]


http://docsfreelunch.blogspot.com

[nul-points]

Yes, nul, we all know about pm generators that first thing what uplifts output voltage is rectifier and second what acts for is Capacitor but never met before that two paralleled dc sources give double voltage ...  perhaps question is about top most peaks and current?  When side by side peaks then for result comes sufficient width of for multimeter
cheers,
khabe

hopefully lidmotor will give us a more complete report soon, khabe

lasersaber also must be close to giving us this sort of operational data - and i think woopy (and some others?) must be nearly at the combined o/p stage too

[CompuTutor]

I've read from page one to page 15 so far,
but I am posting this in case no one else noticed this.

There was a misunderstanding about a pair of cables at the battery,
what you are looking at is inexpensive production techniques at work.

Look again carefully,
the lead shown is nothing more than standard coaxial wire,
the braid goes to the battery post...

Reference:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3842.msg285594#msg285594



EDIT:
Sorry, I see bolt was right on top of it:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=3842.msg285606#msg285606