Peter Davey Heater

[EMdevices]

I'm taking a break from the TPU research  (just for tonight    )   and read this whole thread.

Here's some comments.

1)  The patent link does not work for me (file not found), can somebody repost it, or upload the file?

2)  Nice work and debate guys,  I enjoyed the experiments posted.

3)  Seeing the youtube video of a simular heating device (using stack of plates), reinforces my belief  (see next section)


Personal Opinion:

1)  The main heating energy comes from electricity, however, sonic and convection flows play an important role as follows:

2)  When molecules vaporize and change states from liquid to gas,  a large amount of heat is extracted from the liquid, so energy is escaping in the air and is useless in heating the water. (latent energy of vaporization)

3)  To combat this problem,  water can be heated under high pressure to change its behavior on the Phase state charts, and the whole liquid volume can be brought up in temperature much more efficiently (less heat needed)  High altitude cooking uses the pressure cooker for this purpose since boiling sets in at a much lower temperature then 100 deg C.

4)  These aspects are perhaps at work in the Davey device, since the way the cups are inverted in his heater should tell the intelligent engineer that there is heat transfer occurring between the heated bubbles and the metal spheres (tempeture almost equal to the water temperature) and quite a bit of agitation is occurring that no doubt is aided by the vibration of the spheres to facilitate this heat transfer. 

5)  Sonic energy  (which plays perhaps a bigger role in the Thrapp device) can compress the water and prevent the formation of bubbles to a greater extent, however in the Davey device I'm inclined to believe the gentle vibrations play a bigger role in mixing and agitating the water bubble combination.

6) As a farther example, consider a device that boils water between two electrodes at the bottom of a metallic tube immersed in water, and as the bubbles rise through the tube they have a chance to equalize in temperature as they flow along the narrow tube surface, very much like a heat exchanger.  The tube can be long and winding designed from a heat exchanger perspective.  This will distribute the heat to the water much more rapidly.  (remember bubbles of steam are quite hot and the transfer of heat by conduction is minimal so once they hit the surface the energy is lost which could have heated the rest of the water)

So, in conclusion the Deavy device is a rapid water heater using electricity for power, and effectively preventing boiling heat loss from it's localized heating area (electrodes), by passing the bubbles along the surface of a metallic surface for efficient heat exchange.

I'll check back periodically....

EM

[nul-points]

4)  ...the way the cups are inverted in his heater should tell the intelligent engineer that there is heat transfer occurring between the heated bubbles and the metal spheres ... 

hi EM

...hmmmm, i think the 'intelligent engineer' would look at NerzhDishuals results (replies #197 & #200) posted with diagrams,  see that the COP is approx 1 regardless of which way the 'bells' are oriented, and realise that "the way the cups are inverted in [Davey's] heater" makes absolutely no difference to the efficiency!



so returning to the question of heat transfer from bubbles to water (and also, therefore, to elements) - both the Patent and Davey's later design enclose the electrodes to enhance the heat transfer process, prolonging electrical & physical contact between electrodes and the volume of water currently getting heated, so the major bubbling activity doesn't force the water too far away from the electrodes too soon

this arrangement heats a small volume of water very rapidly before the amount of steam/major bubble activity forces the boiling water out of the top of the enclosure (directed safely downwards, of course!) 'sucking' cooler water into the base of the enclosure to start boiling the next small volume of water

COPS around 1 have already been achieved in ND's replication

so, the real questions to be answered - by experiment - on this thread are:-
a) is there any additional anomalous heating here, due to sonic impact (eg. microcavitation, etc) on the water?
b) is there any additional anomalous heating here, due to audio freq. standing waves?

these actions being caused by vibration of the electrodes (whether just mains freq. induced or at resonant freq. of the 'bell')

my own personal view is that in (b) the distances involved are too small and the turbulent activity too great (due to the vigourous boiling action) to sustain suitable audio standing waves - BUT - i believe the possibility is still worth testing!


great experimentation, monsieur Dishual - and nice test kit, forest - keep it up, guys!

all the best, folks
sandy
Doc Ringwood's Free Energy site  http://ringcomps.co.uk/doc

[NewAge]

I'm taking a break from the TPU research  (just for tonight    )   and read this whole thread.

Here's some comments.

1)  The patent link does not work for me (file not found), can somebody repost it, or upload the file?

http://archive.beinsa.info/Heating/Peter%20Davey/92428.pdf

[forest]

There is one astonishing fact about immersion heaters. My friend told me that he was using two SS razors to immediately boil water when he was in army long time ago. Surprisingly there was no single accident with blowed fuse ! Of course current used was enormous but that's another story...

After debating a little about Davey device we concluded that it may work like a heat pump or simply a water pump - by reoccuring areas of high and low pressure inside sphere and a proper size of inlet and outlet holes there may be many laws involved. For example for a moment when a steam is escaping out of the container there may be a low pressure area and a suction for cold water below . If inlet holes are many in small diameter then a cavitation is able to occur also. I see a resonance here mostly as a process to sustain that pump action and almos continuous steam generation inside sphere. Current required to sustain boiling point inside small area is not big, and this device seems to be working in impulse mode (large peak of current to boil water then a few moments when water is boiling by itself because of steam pressure and flow) . Interesting would be to test such working device with interrupted AC (pulse mode) - current usage could be further limited...

[nul-points]

hi forest

yes, some very interesting & useful ideas there! hope you can get to try some of them out on your test-rig

also, on the interrupted AC possibility, i believe this is the most likely explanation for the Patent reinforcing the requirement for 'loose' electrodes - so they can make intermittent electrical contact when vibrated by the bubbling

good luck with the testing!
sandy