Joule Thief

[nievesoliveras]

@ALL
Supercap warning,
Time for another cartoon folks

During my electrical apprenticeship there was a tradesman out in the back shed, working on an airconditioner. We heard a loud explosion, next we saw he and inside the shed was covered in silver paper, he was blinded by the flash, deafened by the boom, shaking like a leaf.
They are dangerous, so don't reverse the polarity.
Always check if the cap is leaking or has a bulging top

jim

I was working with an HHO with a pulse width modulator (PWM) and it was new. I was running it with a battery charger at just 2 amps.
Suddenly it began to hiss, then it whistle and finally it explode with a very loud bang and let me confused and covered with little pieces of paper.

It was a tremendous and scary experience.

The one that exploded on me was just a mere 47uf 16v...

Jesus

[altrez]

@all

Yes that is how I understood a cap to work. It can NOT go higher then the source voltage so if you have a 2volt EB an a 100 volt cap the cap will only charge up to 2 volts and it will not be full. So if you charged a 2.5v cap with 650F to 1 volt it would not be at full power.

On the flip side if I put 1000 volts into that 2.7 volt cap it would go BANG#@!@!@#!@

-Altrez

[gadgetmall]

@ Gadgetmall:

Thanks, this is good information to have.  As I said, I am in uncharted waters here (aye) as far as my knowledge goes.

The reason I was concerned about overcharging the cap is that the EB by itself puts out 1.95 volts so there should be no problem.  Then, after leaving it hooked to the monstercap overnight, the voltage on the cap was pushing 2.5 volts.  I thought it would stop at around 2 volts but it did not.  That is what Dr. Stiffler was trying to tell me.  He was saying I can't have more volts in the cap than my EB puts out without it....yet....there it is and I am looking at it, almost 2.5 volts in the cap.  This is why I get confused when different folks say different things.  I am keeping an eye on the cap and it has not gone over 2.5 volts yet so maybe that is where it will stay.  I will keep checking it.

Just for the heck of it, I disconnected the cap from the EB and checked the EB's voltage........1.95 vdc!!  The cap without the EB is at 2.5 volts!!!  All I know is that is what it reads and I have no formulas or laws to quote why this is or might be.  As I mentioned before, it may be possible that under a load (the maxcap) the EB may increase the output a bit to compensate.  Stubblefield mentioned something about this several times.  (I really don't know) I am going to mount a heatsink on the Fuji and have a go at it soon, maybe even later tonight if it stops raining.

Thanks for all of your help and information.  I listed a link to your maxcap page on your website on my video side bar so hopefully, you will get some more inquiries.

Bill

Thanks P{irate . And all i know is from the 30 +years a experience with Tronics . i hardly remember College but i remember the Experience of working and all i can do is share that  and learn from you guys.  . I do recommend putting an led or a small incandesant light bulb lamp in series with the fugi
cause you might blow the  windings in that little transformer before you blow the transistor . Thats pushing it but i know it will light 1000 leds now   And Congratulations on running a Bedini . Man I'm Jealous . You Keep on Keepin on though as its great and i want one of those Smacking magnet motors . I  got the Egg magnets . I have no idea where to start but i want a 1 volt bedini  or Newman . That would be some science project . Excuse me i was corrected that was 1770- amps . Ahhmmm.. There is no way to discharge that cap in one second so it got plenty of Kick there Ma Friend . 

@Jesus .Hi .  I'm making it . What toroid are you using if i might ask without hunting thru miles of threads Sir ?  .



Gadget

[gadgetmall]

@all

Yes that is how I understood a cap to work. It can NOT go higher then the source voltage so if you have a 2volt EB an a 100 volt cap the cap will only charge up to 2 volts and it will not be full. So if you charged a 2.5v cap with 650F to 1 volt it would not be at full power.

On the flip side if I put 1000 volts into that 2.7 volt cap it would go BANG#@!@!@#!@

-Altrez

Actually No if you monitor the voltage while you charge it with 1000 volts and stop at the rated voltage .

Also About the cap not going higher than the source voltage .
Someone Explain why i can take a Jt with a secondary . rectify it and measure the volts output , say 15 volts  then put a fugi cap acrossit and it builds up 3 time as high ? I know  this to be True from experience with them . Is it the Spikes i cannot read on the meter ?

Gadget

Flabbergasted 

[Artic_Knight]

He says that there is not much energy stored in my cap at all.  I don't know enough to argue with himbut look at what I was able to do with just two 10 farad caps and now I won't be able to do much with 650?  This makes no sense to me at all.  He is saying I will only have milliwatts for output and again, I find this very hard to believe.
As for the part about someone telling me the cap will continue to charge above my input voltage, well, I have seen that with my own eyes and so no one had to tell me anything.  1.95 vdc input from EB and now over 2.4 vdc on the supercap and climbing.  Something or someone is not correct here.

Bill
even at low volts, at high amps, there are risks of injuries.
ex: burns and also flashes that can damage your eyes

a cap, once full, can't accept more energy.
your super cap will stop storing energy at ~2.7volts provided your voltage source can go that high.


lol
now i know why i keept blowing transistors.
i forgotted that 1 farad  = 1 coulomb/ 1 volts  = 1 amp/second.
the thing is that i posted about this not long ago in an other tread, about units conversion.
but i did not made the relation with my blown out transistors at that time.

thanks, you and mr. Stiffler

bill i have to say that you cant listen to people, i have found in this world that i cannot trust anyone or anything not even myself but that i must prove it myself to know. and yes i said i dont trust my self but have to prove it to myself. i have changed my thoughts soo many times that i see even i make blind assumptions sometimes and have to prove it.

that being said, if someone tells you something, go prove it! right or wrong devise a way to prove it! 

i will honestly say that a cap will only charge in volts what it is supplied so that means your cap is getting 2.7 volts. since your not seeing it on a scope reading that tells me that the additional voltage is hidden in temperary spikes. a simple way you can prove it is to scope the ground. im fairly certain that these spikes roll over the planet with the magnetic lines much like waves in an ocean.

now for the energy density of your 650f cap. we know that a single farad is one amp for one second right?  so we multiply the 2.7 times 650 and we get 1755 now keeping to our rate of measurement that is watts second. to get watts hour we divide by 60^2 (60 seconds times 60 minutes or sixty to the power of 2 equals 3600) so divide 1755 by 3600 and you get 0.4875 watt hours  so that cap stores half a watt under normal measurments.  yes its low but consider the batteries  2700mah thats 2.7a hours. so  1.5 x 2.7 = 4 watts.  if the batteries are rechargable then 1.2 x 2.7 = 3.24 watts hours

caps unfortunately never have really stored that much energy, but if you consider they are a "static" charge then its a crap ton! caps do not have a chemical reaction! thats why they last for so much longer than batteries!

the reason you think they store so much more is because you have been able to really stretch the work you get done with them! first law of going green is energy conservation and thats one thing this forum has really been able to achieve!

i must say if anyone scopes a earth battery please post a pic! that is something i would love to see!