Homopolar Generators (N-Machine) by Bruce de Palma

[mscoffman]

Unlike a normal generator I believe the outer rim of a homopolar generator will always be negative polarity
independent of the direction of the disk rotation. And it is one way to tell whether the unit is homopolar
internally or not.

This is because in a homopolar generator the mobile charge carrier are the electrons. It is as if electron mass comes under the
influence of centrifugal force and they get flung outward toward the disk edges. It's always the mobile electrons which are
being flung. This helps one see why the magnets can be rotated with or not the main disk in a homopolar generator.
This is also the reason why one needs brushes or gears that are fixed to the non-centrifugal reference frame for it to
work.

A wire from the edge of the rotor to the center operating inside the magnetic field will show the same voltage gradient
as the disk and without a voltage difference no current can therefore flow.

The direction of the flux path is curved differently dependent on the direction of rotation. I believe if you have curved slots cut
in the disk, the disk will be different impedances dependent on direction of rotation.

By and large failure to produce homopolar generators are because the flux across the disk needs to be monolithic across the
entire disk-face from center to edges. This means a giant "C" shaped magnet generally to conduct the other flux polarity
outside the disk.

Arrays of powerful magnets allow some flux leakage between magnets. This allows electrons to form eddy current loops
in the disk before the electrons get to the edge.

:S:MarkSCoffman

[tinman]

Unlike a normal generator I believe the outer rim of a homopolar generator will always be negative polarity
independent of the direction of the disk rotation. And it is one way to tell whether the unit is homopolar
internally or not.

This is because in a homopolar generator the mobile charge carrier are the electrons. It is as if electron mass comes under the
influence of centrifugal force and they get flung outward toward the disk edges. It's always the mobile electrons which are
being flung. This helps one see why the magnets can be rotated with or not the main disk in a homopolar generator.
This is also the reason why one needs brushes or gears that are fixed to the non-centrifugal reference frame for it to
work.

A wire from the edge of the rotor to the center operating inside the magnetic field will show the same voltage gradient
as the disk and without a voltage difference no current can therefore flow.

The direction of the flux path is curved differently dependent on the direction of rotation. I believe if you have curved slots cut
in the disk, the disk will be different impedances dependent on direction of rotation.

By and large failure to produce homopolar generators are because the flux across the disk needs to be monolithic across the
entire disk-face from center to edges. This means a giant "C" shaped magnet generally to conduct the other flux polarity
outside the disk.

Arrays of powerful magnets allow some flux leakage between magnets. This allows electrons to form eddy current loops
in the disk before the electrons get to the edge.

:S:MarkSCoffman

Quote: Unlike a normal generator I believe the outer rim of a homopolar generator will always be negative polarity
Mark-if you reverse the direction of rotation of the disk,the polarity changes-this is a know fact.

Quote: This is because in a homopolar generator the mobile charge carrier are the electrons. It is as if electron mass comes under the
influence of centrifugal force and they get flung outward toward the disk edges.

Electron flow is from negative to positive,so if the outer rim was the negative potential,then the electrons would be flowing against the centrifugal force-toward the center of the disk(positive).
The polarity of the voltage can also be changed by changing the magnetic field polarity on each side of the disk-this is also another know fact.

[Dave45]

Can it be built solid state.

[keithturtle]

Hey, Turtle, after reading through much of the last 18 pages it looks like you've been around here for awhile. How is your progress?

Yeah, it's the same place it was in April... stalled.

Not that I don't want to work with it, I just see the need to get some "proven" alternative energy stuff together in case SHTF.

I've got a real effective rocket stove going (Gabe Apostal's design), and some solar PV/hydrogen stuff coming together as well.

No doubt what you say about understanding the critical values and physics will play huge into success of this design; my "TLAR" (that looks about right) engineering approach falls well short of the true science.  I'm not at all well versed in higher math, though I grasp the basic concepts of magnetic interaction that we have at work in this homopolar device.

I think there is merit to the solid-state idea.

Firewood and neanderthal-science take priority at the moment.  When survival is the order of the day, having the right [marketable] stuff ready takes precedence over replicating DePalma.  There's only so many hours in a day.

Thanks for your interest

Turtle, keeping warm

[Magluvin]

Been doing some experiments and found something interesting.

Below are 2 pics. Didnt have the camera at the shop, so I threw together 3d pics.

The pics show aluminum foil on a flat surface and a neo disk magnet, magnetized through length. Best if using 1/4in or more so it can roll without falling over. My 3/4in x  1/8in disks fall over or want to spin like a strong compass because of earths mag field when setting them up on edge.  On the foil, thicker mags have a harder time spinning on edge so we can concentrate on the rolling.

The orange object depicts a solid copper wire 20awg or so, with bent end so the smooth outer elbow can contact the magnet with least drag on the magnets surface. Or something non magnetic.

I used 4 AA batts in series connecting one end to the foil, and one end of the batt pack to the wire, at the end that is not near the magnet, in case you use alligator leads to make connections.


In pic 1, depending on the magnet polarity and battery polarity, when the wire touches the top of the magnet, the magnet will roll in one direction. Reverse either the battery or the magnet, the magnet will roll the other direction.

In pic 2, if you touch the wire to the center of the circular side of the magnet, the magnet will roll in the opposite direction as when contacting the top of the magnet, with battery and magnet of the same polarity in each case. Also, if you touch the wire to the other side of the magnet(pic 2), it will roll the same direction as when contacting the side shown in pic 2.

So, contact the top, and the mag moves say left, and contact the center of either side(pic 2) the magnet will roll right.

The interesting part is, it doesnt matter the orientation of the magnet on the foil, or the orientation of the wire in respect to the magnet. So its not the field from current 'direction' in the foil with respect to where the magnet is on the foil and where the battery pack is connected on the edge of the foil.  As long as current flows through the magnet(pic 1) either up from the bottom of the magnet, or down, the magnet will move on its own, without outside magnetic field influence.

More isolated tests to come. As in, is the magnet 'rolling' (spinning) because of the current flow through the magnet, or, is the magnet as a whole 'forced' in that direction, and the roll is due to friction on the foil?    A coil-less pulse motor with just mags on a rotor and top and bottom contacts? 

Clearly if we change the orientation of how the wire beyond the contact point of the magnet back to the battery, we might expect different angles or even perpendicular from the magnets contact point to affect which way it might roll, or even how strong a roll. Also we might expect a different roll direction if we moved the battery contact to the foil to the opposite outer edge of the foil due to fields developed in the foil from current flow to the bottom rolling edge of the magnet. But no matter the external orientations of external conductors, the mag rolls the same direction as long as mag and electrical polarities are consistent. If the wire is parallel to the contact surface, the field of the wire can cause a little twisting of the mag as it rolls, but still rolls the same.

So, the point is, when the magnet rolls, what is it pushing against(and or pulling towards) if the conductors fields seem to not be in effect when it comes to the magnet rolling with current flowing through it?  Its a strong roll. Like a coil was pulsed near it.

If any of you have these items to try yourselves, please chime in on what you think.  I dont get why the mag rolls in the opposite direction when contacting the top or the sides of the magnet, yet. I used 4 AA in series to show nice moving effects without burning the magnets surface badly, as I did with a 12v 12ah agm batt.  Use safety goggles if wandering into the higher voltage/current sources.  1 AA doesnt really get it going. Just a little jiggle.    

I tested the raw neo material of a broken like magnet for continuity, and it measures the same low ohms as the nickle shell coating, .00 ohms Wavetek 2030.  So the magnet as a whole is conducting the currents, not just the outer coating.

Will be back for more on what I think about this in a bit. And also another test I did.

Mags