ENERGY AMPLIFICATION

[MarkE]

TinselKoala,MarkE

I'm using trigger on channel A with Auto trigger. I don't understand what Normal trigger mode can do, mostly it looks the same as Auto one.And yes, I'm using ALT view to see both signals from Channel A and B so I can scroll one of them to bu upper and one lower and compare. I wish you know what I mean.So, should I change to Normal triggering mode and trigger only on channel A with scope connected to the output of microcontroller and scope on channel B connected to the coil end near the Source of mosfet ? Is that correct ?


P.S. Tinsel, Wow! Don't you think you react too emotionally ? Aaron is maybe a sneaky pal trying to get attention but this experiment with car coil is really cool and has a secret hidden ,maybe 
Do you REALLY wish to "fight to death" defending current scientific dogma
, even if the change is right behind the corner ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-NhDeNGh7M&list=UUZjwwSkok_CxM1zRFx2EBLg&index=9

Forest, the difference between auto and normal triggering modes is that the auto mode triggers whether or not the signal meets the trigger criteria.  What you want the oscilloscope to do is paint each the A and B traces with the same timing relationship to some reference event.  In order to establish that relationship, you need to trigger against a signal that has as close to a constant relationship to both signals as possible.  Normal trigger mode fires if and only if the trigger signal meets the criteria set-up by the trigger controls:  source, rising or falling edge, coupling and level.  The shorter the rise or fall time of your reference timing signal the less uncertainty there will be in the trigger.  If you have a logic signal that has a cleaner rectangle waveform than both your A and B signals, then as TK suggests, connecting that signal to your external trigger input promises to give you the most stable timing.  If either the A or B signal has a clean signal with rise or fall time that is as good as or close to that of the most pristine signal that you have then you can use that channel:  A or B as your trigger source and the timing stability will be similar to what you can get using the external trigger input.

Auto trigger mode can give you a lot of trouble, particularly in alternate sweep mode because any given trigger can be either from the reference event or the oscilloscope's internal free running trigger.

So, start by triggering on the cleaner of your two waveforms in normal mode with DC trigger coupling.  You will have to adjust the trigger level until you get a stable waveform.  Do that for the A channel only.  When the display is stable, then you can turn the B channel on using either chopped or alternate sweep.  If you have stability issues due to a slowly changing or non-monotonic signal then use a third signal such as TK has suggested as an input to the oscilloscope's external trigger, select the external trigger as the trigger source and get channel A stabilized as before.  Then turn on the B channel.

[MarkE]

Was following the post and I was curious how much truth and wisdom could be found at forum of this kind.
We must always listen to the opinions of others, and we must know how to take the best of those opinions but do not mean that to be the most certain.

Surely there will be some people who have devoted a great deal of his time to this type of work and is  only by bigotry as Aaron? I think not ....
The effect that Aaron demonstrated that it was not so basic as described herein.
This same effect contrary to what has been said, can be played without the use of power grid and with only with only 12V.

This just to see fit that there are no absolute truths and that laws were created by men in order to be convenient.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DfxEAQNOjp0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pf_qUlwSZl0


I think I'm one of the people that Tim mentioned as part of the people who do not know what they are doing.

But after solemn speech I even feel more comforted by what I do.

Lots of luck to you in your investigations and your decisions

Nelson, reliable data always tells the story.  90%, or maybe as much as 99% of the battle is getting reliable data.  Aaron has in the past been difficult because he resisted both explanation of obvious errors he was making and also to perform tests of his own to validate his beliefs a number of which TK proved were false.

[TinselKoala]

TinselKoala,MarkE

I'm using trigger on channel A with Auto trigger. I don't understand what Normal trigger mode can do, mostly it looks the same as Auto one.And yes, I'm using ALT view to see both signals from Channel A and B so I can scroll one of them to bu upper and one lower and compare. I wish you know what I mean.So, should I change to Normal triggering mode and trigger only on channel A with scope connected to the output of microcontroller and scope on channel B connected to the coil end near the Source of mosfet ? Is that correct ?


P.S. Tinsel, Wow! Don't you think you react too emotionally ? Aaron is maybe a sneaky pal trying to get attention but this experiment with car coil is really cool and has a secret hidden ,maybe 
Do you REALLY wish to "fight to death" defending current scientific dogma
, even if the change is right behind the corner ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-NhDeNGh7M&list=UUZjwwSkok_CxM1zRFx2EBLg&index=9

If you don't want to take my advice about using the external trigger capability of your scope that is of course entirely up to you. It's funny that you seem reluctant even to try it, though.

Generally, "Normal" trigger mode blanks the trace(s) when no signal that exceeds the manually set trigger voltage level is detected by the scope, so the screen goes dark. "Auto" trigger mode overrides this and will generally display the trace(s) regardless of sensed voltage, so you can display a flat line if you like or let the scope trigger on whatever p-p voltage it sees without you having to fiddle with the manual trigger level setting. You're welcome.


You have no idea about my history with Aaron Murakami, do you. Even though I have given you some references and I can back up everything I say, including the fact that he lied about me, about the Ainslie circuit and about his own "contributions" to that story. That's fine too, you can believe whatever you want to believe, and waste your time however you want to waste it.
We went around and around about the relationship between the Ainslie published 555 timer circuit and its duty cycle and the mosfet's response, Aaron accused me of errors and even fakery, and eventually he resorted to having to change many parts of the Ainslie published circuit so that it would finally do what HE said rather than what I said... and he never apologized or admitted he was wrong the whole time.  Even now there exists a PDF document that he and his cohort Ashtweth wrote, that lies about me and about the duty cycle issue. You can look at his early videos with his new oscilloscope from that time and see for yourself that he did not know how to use it, and displayed screen after screen of garbage, false triggering and meaningless combs that were impossible to interpret properly, claiming that they represented phenomena in the circuit.
Here is just one of a large handful of videos that I made during that time in an attempt to illustrate and explain the 555 duty cycle issue to Aaron and Ainslie.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QhIDnjmPjW4
The argument even descended to this level, where I demonstrate a simple circuit that Aaron himself proposed, but never actually tested, he thinking it would support HIS point but actually as you can see it supports MY point instead. Do I sound angry in this video? Yes, I am indeed irate about having to do utterly remedial, eighth-grade level demonstrations to try to educate someone with as little integrity as Aaron Murakami.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSFS99SaZTA


You think their "experiment" with the car coil is "really cool" with maybe a hidden secret, but you have nothing to say about my own demonstrations with the car coil?
I'm crushed, absolutely crushed.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSMb69N39CQ

[TinselKoala]

I forgot to mention the video you linked. That is nothing new or remarkable at all, it simply illustrates what I said when I talked about my work with Peter Graneau. The presenter is discharging a capacitor bank into a chamber with a little water in it and producing a supersonic shockwave by the rapid flashing of the water to superheated steam in the arc channel.  If he sealed the chamber tightly and filled it completely with water, the shockwave could even destroy the chamber itself. Again, you can believe what I am telling you, or not, it won't change the facts of the matter or the fact that I got paid handsomely during those research years for my expertise and assistance, things that I am giving to you here for nothing...except the abuse I get in return.

But since you brought it up... here's something that pushes the boundaries: underwater wireless electrolysis proof of concept demonstration:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97ogTf3S3r8

[nelsonrochaa]

Nelson
Counting on your amps usage maybe also using 9V battery  but I understand you may have no reason to use it  and took negative comments.
It remains me some effect of an arrow when it sharply pierce into the hard wood.The arrow movement is abruptly stopped yet still there is energy flow which cannot dissipate and return back and form kind of very fast oscillations of the end part of arrow beatting against the air...

Hi Forest,
The only simple reason to use a 12v battery is because the car relay is 12v . How you  think i can use the 12v relay vibrate at 5kz with a 9v battery and maintain oscillation?If i want use 9v battery i have to find a 9v relay:) but for me it isn't important , because this piece of scrap (circuit) is only to study and observe.
Thanks




Im not worry about took negative comments because i learn with all information even failed tests.