Homopolar capacitor motor?

[Aka]

I have had this idea in my head for a while now ever since I was reading one of the posts on here (which for some reason I cant seem to find atm) the topic which I refer to ended up talking about trying to connect a capacitor directly onto the homopolar motor to try and spin the whole circuit to see if you can trickle the energy into the cap without creating forces that slows the rotation

so I got thinking rather than soldering a capacitor directly we could try making the whole spinning disc into a capacitor by rolling a long strip of aluminium around the axle with a strip of insulation the same way as you would roll up a homemade capacitor... this would make a capacitor disc which the center would be one connection and the outside would be the other... maybe this could improve the voltage by acting as a capacitor? maybe even discharging over a spark gap or into other caps out of reach of the magnet

I have also been thinking of other designs that could be different to what has been tried already

the second Idea that came to mind was to get a series of thin metal discs instead of the single thick metal disc... I was thinking of induction being able to transport the energy out of each disc if the discs were close enough and would act like a capacitor... the idea was to have the plates either all connected or to have neutral plates like in electrolysis plate designs where one or two were connected but the others remained neutral to maybe get some storage of energy

The third Idea was similar to the second but all plates were connected in a spiral pattern like the Bitter plate electromagnets, creating a "solid" disc

have not read anything about anyone trying such things so I thought I should post it to find out if anyone thinks it could work, or if anyone has already tried this or similar

.

[gravityblock]

That capacitor idea was mine.  It was to show that current can flow in the rotating frame without relative motion.  That doesn't really matter, since we're not in the rotating frame, but are in the stationary frame.

There are two things we want to avoid in the HPG or HPM.  1)  Avoid brushes.  Huge losses associated with them.  2)  Eliminate the relative motion between the discs and external circuit, to avoid the counter torque and brushes when drawing current.

This can be accomplished if we can get the magnetic field to rotate with the magnet.  Then all we need is a stationary disc on each side of the rotating magnet.  Hook the stationary discs in series and extract the current between the discs.  No brushes and no counter torque while we increased the voltage potential to the 4th power and the input requirements only increased to the 2nd power thereof.

I believe the magnetic field of a Halbach Array would rotate on it's magnetic axis.  Instead of rotating the magnet mass, there are those attempting to create a rotating magnetic field using coils to create a "Motionless Variant of the HPG".  It is known as the TPU.  The only thing that rotates is the magnetic field, everything else is stationary.

Either way, it will take energy to rotate the magnet mass or to keep the coils energized.  The mathematics suggest that it would be more efficient to rotate the PM mass than to keep the coils energized.

If it can't be done in the HPG with the magnetic field rotating with the magnet, then it can't be done in the "motionless variants".  It may not be possible to get the field to rotate with the magnet, so the TPU has this advantage.

I would like to hear possible ideas on how to get the magnetic field to rotate on it's magnetic axis, such as the Halbach Arrays (not tested yet).

Fill up a bank of capacitors in series, Ist (Innovation Station) knows how to do this, LOL....... and run the HPG from the capacitors.  You'll be able to deliver continuous output power, as long you don't use more than the input requirements of the system, and should deliver a substantial amount of available output power.

GB

[gravityblock]

Below is an illustration.  The magnetic fields will be rotating with the magnet (assuming it is possible, such as a Halbach Array).  Everything else is stationary.  Does not need brushes and does not need relative motion between the disc and external circuit. 

There will be a voltage potential generated between the two discs, since the EMF of each disc are pointing in opposite directions, thus current will flow between the discs.  The discs are naturally connected in series, thus increasing the power output to the 4th power while the input requirements only increase to the 2nd power thereof.

This will work, if the magnetic field can be made to rotate with the magnet.  Would make for a good TPU alternative, since it would be much easier to replicate.

GB

[exnihiloest]

...
about trying to connect a capacitor directly onto the homopolar motor to try and spin the whole circuit to see if you can trickle the energy into the cap without creating forces that slows the rotation
...

You should learn special relativity. Only an observer at rest see a voltage between the axis and the rim of a disk rotating in a magnetic field.
In the Lorentz force F=q*v.B, v is the speed of the charges relative to the observer. From the viewpoint of a capacitor rotating with the charges, charges speed is null, then there is no voltage.

[Aka]

yeah I think setting up the capacitor as in the original topic was to test this idea of the observer in relation to the rotating disk

in my first drawing the idea is that the electricity produced would have to travel through the length of the foil rather than with the normal disk only having a small way to travel of the radius between the center and the outer rim on the solid disk, the connections for the foil disk would still be on the axle from the center and the outer rim which would be the observer, but as the current travels through the foil to the connections maybe its possible that it could act like a capacitor and change the voltage exiting from the connections

so from the two connections (observers) viewpoint the foil disk is spinning, but with current flowing through the length of the foil maybe it can change the voltage output?