STEORN DEMO LIVE & STREAM in Dublin, December 15th, 10 AM

[lumen]

Remember, winding a single layer around the core, will have the CEMF of one loop of wire under the right setup!

[hartiberlin]

Sean had a circuit diagram on the overhead projector. Has anybody posted what that was?

Yes, I also would like to see the slides that Sean showed there.
Did anybody from the forum users over here go there and took pictures of these ?

Many thanks.

[Airstriker]

Hi guys (thanks for still ignoring me ;] )

First of all, Paul is for sure right that it's metglas. At the begining I thought it should be mumetal 76 because of it's low saturation point. But hey! Let's have a look at metglas. It only requires 0,57 T to saturate! It's just like nothing.

Another interesting property of METGLAS® Square Loop magnetic cores: Low saturated permeability !

Now go back to video: "Steorn examine attempted replications of Orbo Technology".
What do you see at the gaussmeter? 0,5 T per magnet? Yes you're right!

Since "recent NdFeB magnets are capable of producing a surface field that would completely saturate the metglas and reduce permeability as it did, thus reducing the attraction when in contact", than think how much current do you need at TDC to saturate this metglass core ?:> The answer is: almost NONE or simply NONE!

Note here, that this is exactly why we need two magnets (as Sean did) - to make the magnet's flux lines go through the toroid (tried it at FEMM - works).


Now...

Lets go back to my equation (by the way it's simply the law of conservation of energy aplied here):

i x v = dL/dt x 1/2 x i^2

First of all, why a hell are you still talking about maximising torque??!!! As I said torque does not matter at all! I don't want to repeat why - just look a few posts back ;]

As it's clear now, let's add another equation:

L=u*(N^2)*A/(2*3.14*r)

(thanks mikestocks2006)

What's important in this equation is the fact that L is the higher, the higher is permeability. Now do you remember Staffman's graph "Amplitude Permeability vs. Flux Density"? What you find in this graph is: The higher the flux density, the lower the permeability. I bet this graph looks very similiar for metglas (can somebody find it please ?)
So now you know where the change in Inductance comes from, right ? Just a property of the core's material.


Ok now lets modify a bit my understanding of ORBO's interaction:

1) We assumed that at TDC the core is saturated just by magnets or requires very little current to saturate. The current is minimal.
2) As we move further with the magnet we only slightly need to rise the current to keep the saturation of the core (as the flux density "coming" from the magnets drops with the distance to toroid).
3) point 1 and 2 simply explains the "exponential lag" of current versus voltage on Sean's osciloscope during the demo show.
3) Since we keep the core saturated the Inductance does not change (flux density is kept constant so permeability stays constant)
4) There is no interaction with the magnet (no Lenz effect) due to core saturation
5) At the proper moment we colapse the field and result in postion where the flux density "coming" from the magnet is minimal, thus the permeability of metglas is maximum (not exactly but close to that) and so the Inductance has risen. Colapsing the field with higher Inductance than at TDC results in electrical energy gain.
6) The higher the RPM the smaller the time frame where you apply energy (current) to keep the core saturated. Thus the higher the RPM, the closer to ratio 1/1 when considering energy input vs energy output.
7) Utilize free kinetic energy of the motor using additional generator
Use the COP > 1 you got to charge your phone ;]

One more question to be asked and answered. Why only few coil turns ( < 40) on the core? Simple - to stay with low resistance and this way minimize the heat loss.

Something not right with this idea ? Just tell me where and do not simply ignore it !!!!

Best regards,
Julian S.

[lumen]

If the steel toroid core has 1000 times less permeability, and (1.8T / 0.57T) = 3.16 times saturation, then it requires 1000 * 3.16^2 = 10000 times more energy to saturate the steel core. 

Gee, If this was true, then wouldn't you also get 10000 times more energy out when it un-saturates? 

Striker,
I like your thinking but I also believe the direction of saturation from the magnets needs to be along the core in the same direction as the coil current will continue the saturation. If not, then isn't current wasted in the realignment of the core domains and nothing is gained except for the leaving of the magnets.
Also, increasing the RPM will not decrease input because the duty cycle is constant. (50% duty cycle is 50% at any RPM). The gain will come from the constant torque X RPM. Work is RPM x torque so if torque is constant, then work out increases with RPM.

[gravityblock]

@AirStriker:

It's not being ignored.  You're right on the money.  Broli had posted this thread, http://www.overunity.com/index.php?topic=8576.0 about "energy gain by inductance change" before the release of this information from the Steorn Demo's.  It's not getting much attention either and I don't know why.  It could be that it's not understood by most.

We're walking in new territory and it takes awhile to get your mind to completely wrap around and understand the concept.  Like I said in a previous post here, "We will all be believers soon".   Steorn is legit and we need to have a little patience before all of the pieces are put together.  It appears at the moment we know enough information to begin successful replications.  It will still be a rough road due to the high tolerances and to have all of the components to be matched for optimal performance.  We're getting close, I feel it.


GB