Mostly Permanent Magnet Motor with minimal Input Power

[gotoluc]

You're welcome, and you know I'm not knocking your efforts.

Here's what I get, running the energy in the cap against the potential energy of the lift.

You've lifted 120 grams by 1 millimeter, using a cap of 0.272 microFarad charged to 325 Volts.

Putting everything in mks units we have
0.120 kg lifted 0.001 meter using a cap of 0.000000272 Farad at 325 Volts.

The energy on the cap is
(CV^2)/2 ==  (1/2) x (0.000000272) x (325) x (325) == just under 0.015 Joule.

The energy of the lifted mass (gravitational potential energy, the energy it takes to lift the mass against gravity) is
(mgh) == (0.120) x (9. x (0.001) == just under 0.0012 Joule.

(I usually just use 10 m/s^2 for g, the local acceleration due to gravity, but 9.8 is more correct if more difficult to calculate with. I've always believed that Earth's gravity was a bit light, anyway.... it should be one Standard G of 10 meters per second per second exactly.)

Now, you are almost certainly also fighting against friction and other drag forces like eddy current drag so it will actually take somewhat more energy to lift your mass a given height, but unfortunately these will also work against you in the other direction as well and so represent (probably unrecoverable) losses to the system. So you can say that it takes  _at least_  0.0012 Joule for your system to raise your mass, possibly much more. Ten times more, due to losses? So if your system actually expends ten times the GPE, or 0.012 Joule, to lift the mass .... that is still less than the 0.015 Joule that you started with in the capacitor.

I'm bad about decimal points, though. I've checked this a couple times and I still wind up with a dismal efficiency of around 8 percent, from cap energy to mass lift.

(ETA: I think the first way I'd try, to improve the energy transfer, would be to tune for  the "critically damped" condition. )

Thanks for making the calculations TK

So 8% only ... I quickly read the posts below and it seems Stefan saying I'm close to unity!.... any idea how that could be?

Thanks my friend

Luc

[hartiberlin]

Oh and i can already hear your next question:

What if we change the magnets to North-South-South-North?

Well here it is see the vid.

Hi  microcontroller,

what was the exact configuration when you DID NOT get induction and what was the case, when you DID GET

induction ?

Many thanks.-

Regards, Stefan.


What was the coil and magnet orientation then ?

[hartiberlin]

Hi Luc,
you need at least to get 10 times better with your lift to get into the
unity range.
To get conclusive overunity you need to get about15 to 20 times better so you could also close the loop.

So you really need to get much bigger magnets and setups and also much bigger cores.

Size really matters here and this is the case with ALL magnetic setups to get good efficiency and
reduce losses...

Regards, Stefan.

[gotoluc]

Luc,


I had to do a quick test on your neat idea. 


The coil is 27mm wide with about 730 turns of #25 wire for 12 ohms. Running on 12 volts is about 12 watts.


The magnets are 1/2 x 1 1/2 inches (12 x 38mm) the rod is 3 inches of 1 1/2 inch CR steel (76 x 35mm)


For the pull test I am starting with the coil to the left and pulling to the right.


With single magnets the initial pull is .75 KG's finishing at 1.02 kG's


With two magnets each end the pull is 1.2 kG's and 1.4 kG's


This is quite a contrast with a solenoid where the pull is very slight at the start and ramps up to maximum only at the end of the pull in.


On the use of a crankshaft: I would suggest timing the pulse to only cover say 80% of the stroke and so when the crank pin is immediately in front of or 180 at the other end of the stroke there is no pulse input. A small flywheel would carry the machine through the dead band.


Ron

Hi Ron,

great test!... thanks for trying it out.

Regarding the coil stroke time. I think the motor should be a 2 cylinder minimum so you reduce the power stroke of each coil but each coil covers the other coils off time so we have zero dead spot. The motor would have 100% torque at 360 degrees rotation.

Luc

[gotoluc]

Hi Luc,
well done new video.

In your video 5 about it,
you would need to lift this coil up 1.2 cm to get to 100 % efficiency.
All over 1.2 cm lift would be overunity at this cap size and charged voltage.

But you only lifted it maybe 1 mm ? So you need to get it lifted 10 times better,
which could be probably done by just using many more and much stronger magnets...

Magnet motors and things have to be build at least 10 times more bigger than this to get into the
overunity mode. If you build it too small, you will never have the chance to get it to overunity !

Here always the truth it: Size matters and bigger is better !

Regards, Stefan,

Hi Stefan,

that's good if we are close!... I'll see if I can make some lamination sides for the outside of the test coil. That should give it an extra boost.

Luc