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Overunity Machines Forum



Constant flux DC motor/generator.

Started by broli, December 13, 2009, 07:08:05 PM

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0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

lumen

Your last design brings up the problem I have faced several times.
Most will not believe this true for some reason that prevents them from seeing it.

In the symmetrical density field like you have, applying a current to the loop pushes more lines of force to the other side of the loop and should cause rotation. Instead, nothing will move because you are only moving the field around the circular path.

There is nothing to contain the field from just rotating around the gap since the force lines bunched up on one side of the current carrying loop will just push on the next field line, then the next and they will just rotate around the gap until they once again come upon the current loop.

Magnetic field lines of force are not forced stationary in space, they simply move to fill any gap of less density. If you had two loops where one worked against the other, then the field would be retained from rotating and something would build force.

If what I said was true, then placing a current on one loop should produce an equal current in a second loop on the opposite side as the field is rotated around the gap by the first loop. Like a type of DC transformer!













broli

Lumen I think you are unnecessarily complicating things by using force fields. It's a simple fact that moving charge in a field creates force, this force has also a reaction force on the source of the field. In our care being the magnetic domains near the gap. You simply use this force to your advantage. So far I have only seen one design that takes advantage of this source:

Figure 2: http://www.andrijar.com/dcmachines/index.html

I'm open to any kind of feedback positive or negative. But your last explanation makes no sense to me in any way. You accept that there are forces acting on the wire but not on the magnetic part?

lumen

QuoteIt's a simple fact that moving charge in a field creates force

This is not always true! The above statement implies that the charge is moving AND cutting field lines.
It can be moving in a field but not cutting field lines and no force will be generated!
If the field is moving with the charge, no work is done.
If the conductor is moving with the field no charge is generated!

Your design is trying to operate in a homopolar field of constant density.
Think of the gap in your design as being filled with thousands of tiny strings stretching from one side to the other.
Every string is equally spaced because they all repel each other.
Now, when you put the current through the conductor, a circular field is generated around the conductor that pushes the strings that were coming down on the conductor to one side. This shifts all the others to try to maintain equal spacing again!


broli

Quote from: lumen on December 14, 2009, 07:18:43 PM
This is not always true! The above statement implies that the charge is moving AND cutting field lines.
It can be moving in a field but not cutting field lines and no force will be generated!
If the field is moving with the charge, no work is done.
If the conductor is moving with the field no charge is generated!

Your design is trying to operate in a homopolar field of constant density.

Yes this is inspired by my homopolar research. But I still don't know why you don't agree. The charge is moving inside, thus cutting, a magnetic field. This will cause the forces and thus reaction forces. If you glue both sides there will be no NET torque but the forces are still present only canceling each other, but when you split it up both sides can rotate individually and thus both will rotate in opposite direction. Newtons third law holds and momentum conservation holds.

If the reaction forces where not present newtons third law would be violated and thus unidirectional forces arise and we can fly to the moon. But so far it has never been violated in these setups there's always a reaction force on the magnetic source.

lumen

The moving charge is shifting the field and would normally cause force if the charge caused a change in field density as is true of all electric motors.
In this case the field density cannot change so no force can be generated. This is like the homopolar motor, except the homopolar motor has an external circuit to contain or trap the field between and cause a change in field density. This is what pushes the homopolar motor.

Your design does not have the external circuit to trap the field so the charge just shifts the field and no work is done.
It is an interesting design though. I think I might build something like this just to test the DC transformer concept and show the field shift once and for all.