Not everyone likes the truth, but I am sure many of you will find this an interesting read.
http://revolution-green.com/2013/10/17/hho-injection-diesels-truth/ (http://revolution-green.com/2013/10/17/hho-injection-diesels-truth/)
Hi Mark,
Thanks for starting this topic, only thinking its a to small place here on OU, for a combustion topic like this!
Did read: People here claiming to know all about combustion engine's, only not what Dwell is!
---------------
Emulsified Fuels are what we use, this after a lot (10.000 hours) of testing, and checking with engine's apart!
The first start with emulsified-fuel, was of course strange and very funny feeling in our head and stomach, feeding a engine with so much water!?
At the end our best idea ever, against CO2, Nox and our Fuel-Bill!
Big customers (the friends) are using it, like many Air-Plane lines, look such a engine's: http://www.emfuel.com/
------------------------
The combo of HHO and emulsified fuel, is 50% fuel reduction: http://www.youtube.com/user/OostromTechnicsSL (http://www.youtube.com/user/OostromTechnicsSL)[/font][/size]
Its so easy, only the world is so called studied and direct so chicken!
Grap a old engine and build & try, the only advise to come of that Sky (mmHigh) fear.
Welcome here!
Regards, Johan
see Hydromoving System[/font][/size]
https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.302114429927865.1073741827.183512198454756&type=1
Hi Johan,
Many thanks
I have seen first hand good results with emulsified fuels, they do work...in the range of 10% to 30% on oil burners. In engines we could never do better than 5% but they did reduce NOx and EGT. To much water and you extinguish the flame.
I just posted here as i know there is a lot of mis information on the net regards HHO
I wanted to point out the volumes of data available that is real and scientifically obtained.
Kind Regards
http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/a801082.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Water_injection_%28engines%29
;)
Hi Mark,
Forgive me for my English?
Water falls apart in H & O at 2000C, we only don't reach those temp's in a engine or Oil-Heating.
------------------
Soap based on Lithium changes / lower this temp, to only 1000C, we pay 60 EURO Cents for a liter of this soap.
Finding proof of all Political not wanted working matter or device's, from UNI's are for sure very rare. They are payed by ............ , you will not find the us helping stuff.
------------------
Just find, for example: "reinhard strey emulsified fuel", why is he sponsored by Soap maker "Henkel", working for a Uni and 4 patents on his personal name related to his Government Payed work, Germany?
Its simple, take a old Diesel-Engine, 75% Diesel, 1 % Lithium Soap, rest is water= 25% FUEL Reduction, almost 50% less CO2, 10-15 Less NoX, costs experiment a 1000 Euro?
A bit education, makes people believe in Religion called a Good Daddy, Politics!?
Look these guy's or google for others: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JREBz-Jhi1M
Big boots and plane's are using WorldWide massive a milky pre-mixed fuel!
More clear films where taken of YT, Mobile's, Phone or ADSL stopped working, now my 3 LinkedIn page why? The hole try to help mankind did cost us a real 500.000 EURO, only the small One-Paper-People as Uni-Product, are fixed in there ManMade-religion based on fear for losing there job.
Welcome here!
Kind Regards,
Johan
Johan
Thank you so very much for sharing this info.
can this Lithium soap be made at home[from lithium grease] or purchased somewhere?
Will this work with the home heating??
thank you for all you can share!!
Chet
From one of Johan links, an italian guy showing his HHO equipped car.
Now I do not speak Italian, EDIT : Looks like he is just adding HHO, 70-30?
Does someone speak italian here? What is he claiming?
He has not one video, but multiple including scopeshots.
Unfortunatly not open source.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-7s0Tyq84s (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-7s0Tyq84s)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gvr-J4zA3kE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gvr-J4zA3kE)
http://www.youtube.com/user/lorenzoerrico/videos (http://www.youtube.com/user/lorenzoerrico/videos)
Quote from: ramset on October 18, 2013, 01:21:32 PM
Johan
Thank you so very much for sharing this info.
can this Lithium soap be made at home[from lithium grease] or purchased somewhere?
Will this work with the home heating??
thank you for all you can share!!
Chet
Dear Ramset,
Use the info, its real and they are making clouds high, to high for natural clouds above us, only not with only water, think!
About the Soap:
Your right, soap and grease are Lithium or .......... based.
We did try a lot of different soap, the one I spoke about is just Supermarket for Dishes / Plates just out of the kitchen.
Also did have some contact with different manufactory, only then they smell dollars, makes a liter price less interesting!
Test and use the simple CHEAP soaps, the luxury soap with cream or other add-on's are getting baken or solid with temp in the injectors.
About heating:
We did test emulsified-fuel on 3 different brand of boiler / heating, Roca, Viesmann and Tifell.
All the 3 brands of simple blower driven oil-burners are not capable or reaching the wanted 1000C.
Later we did make 3 different tests / way's of a small Gas ad-on, and did manage the wanted savings on heating-device's.
First test with a small HHO-cel, Second test with a bit Propaan/Butaan, Third test with a small destillation column realizing gas from the used oil.
So in this way we did get it also working on these class of low-temp burner.
Only advise: Purchase a good flowmeter!
Questions; Ask!
Regards, Johan
Quote from: Cherryman on October 18, 2013, 06:15:42 PM
From one of Johan links, an italian guy showing his HHO equipped car.
Now I do not speak Italian, EDIT : Looks like he is just adding HHO, 70-30?
Does someone speak italian here? What is he claiming?
He has not one video, but multiple including scopeshots.
Unfortunatly not open source.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-7s0Tyq84s (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s-7s0Tyq84s)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gvr-J4zA3kE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gvr-J4zA3kE)
http://www.youtube.com/user/lorenzoerrico/videos (http://www.youtube.com/user/lorenzoerrico/videos)
Dear Cherryman,
These are not mine Italian-links, adding on HHO beside the stupid electronics is not smart.
The electronics are not bringing any advantage in saving, only that we can't work on our own car's anymore!
The engine with electronics is not real giving more performance, only a bit cleaner in a stupid complicated way.
----------------------
HHO is great, when you also make the engine working on the 50% working vacuum cycle, to use the contraction.
Study Papp's
first patent and forget about the special gas mix, is just atmospheric air, and read about WATER percentage.
Regards, Johan
Quote from: Cherryman on October 18, 2013, 06:15:42 PM
Does someone speak italian here? What is he claiming?
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/nissan/370z/17701/marangoni-370-z-hydro
Quote
Verdict 4 The Marangoni Z-Hydro is designed for those who think a regular Nissan 370Z isn't dramatic enough! With scissor doors, a well judged bodykit and gorgeous 20-inch alloy wheels allied to matt white paintwork, it really stands out. But the visual tweaks are a smokescreen for some genuinely interesting technology, which seeks to reduce harmful emissions and improve fuel economy. Marangoni's claims are almost as dramatic as the Z-Hydro's looks – and we can't wait to see how the science behind it develops.
Read more: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/nissan/370z/17701/marangoni-370-z-hydro#ixzz2iBa2Dsit (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/nissan/370z/17701/marangoni-370-z-hydro#ixzz2iBa2Dsit)
[/color]
Quote
Meet the stunning scissor-doored super-coupé that drinks fuel like a supermini!
This incredible machine is the Z-Hydro – a one-off show car that started life as a Nissan 370Z. Thanks to Italian tyre company Marangoni, and a host of its tuning partners, it's now a 155mph eco warrior that does nearly 40mpg and emits only 148g/km of CO2. And Auto Express has driven it.
Regular readers might recall our last meeting with Rome-based Marangoni in Issue 1,046, when we drove the M430 – a modified Alfa Romeo MiTo. Like that car, the Z-Hydro is a very Italian affair. Its Lamborghini Countach-style doors, 20-inch alloys and dramatic bodykit are the work of Florence-based tuning firm TRC Italia, while Marangoni itself has supplied M Power blue-tinted tyres.
Other modifications include lowered suspension and Tar Ox brakes with composite discs, while inside there's lots of blue leather and Alcantara suede. But the most interesting technology is hidden. Mounted behind the gaping front bumper is a clever piece of kit that splits water into oxygen and hydrogen, then injects the gas – oxyhydrogen – into the V6 engine's air intake.
Marangoni's co-development partners, TRC Italia, HydroMoving and Mariani Engineering, say the improved combustion process reduces harmful emissions, such as CO2, by 40 per cent. It also improves fuel economy by the same amount – but maintains the 3.7-litre car's 322bhp. In the future, the Hydro kit could be tuned to deliver more power.
Sound too good to be true? Sceptics argue that the energy required to produce oxyhydrogen exceeds that recouped by burning it. Marangoni rejects this, claiming the process is so efficient that the car is as green as its remarkable figures suggest.
On the move, the changes to the suspension and wheels ensure that, apart from having a firmer ride, the Z-Hydro feels similar to a regular 370Z. The Hydro kit doesn't affect the V6's performance, and it offers muscular urge with lots of low-down torque, while those wide tyres only enhance the handling.
Marangoni plans to offer the Hydro system as a retro-fit kit for around £800, and is even looking at licensing it to major car makers. In the meantime, all the other components are available now – and many owners are sure to be tempted to give their 370Z a dose of extra visual excitement.
Rival: BMW Vision ED
brilliant EfficientDynamics concept combines a 1.5-litre diesel unit with two electric motors to deliver M3 pace with 99g/km emissions and 75mpg economy. The set-up will power BMWs of the future.
Read more: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/nissan/370z/17701/marangoni-370-z-hydro#ixzz2iBa8EzDC (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/nissan/370z/17701/marangoni-370-z-hydro#ixzz2iBa8EzDC)
Key specs
Quote
* Price: £45,000 (est)
* Engine: 3.7-litre V6 petrol, 322bhp
* Transmission: Six-speed manual, rear-wheel drive
* 0-62mph: 5.3 seconds
* Top speed: 155mph
* Economy: 37.7mpg (claimed)
* CO2: 148g/km (claimed)
* Equipment: Scissor doors, TRC Italia-designed bodykit, blue Alcantara seats, 20-inch alloys
* On sale: Now
Read more: http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/nissan/370z/17701/marangoni-370-z-hydro#ixzz2iBaCl7Gg (http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/nissan/370z/17701/marangoni-370-z-hydro#ixzz2iBaCl7Gg)
[/color]
Johan
Thanks for the info,I will be researching the lithium additive and greatly appreciate your offer to answer questions.
have you played with the lithium in an electrolyte to see if the gasses can evolve with less input energy?
thx
Chet
Johan
All my Soaps are coming up Greasy ?
http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=lithium+soaps&id=82EE2F19760E3BF4866268A78B04F4F27138C7A5&FORM=IQFRBA (http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=lithium+soaps&id=82EE2F19760E3BF4866268A78B04F4F27138C7A5&FORM=IQFRBA)
Johan if you could give a link to this one
Qoute
Soap based on Lithium changes / lower this temp, to only 1000C, we pay 60 EURO Cents for a liter of this soap.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would greatly appreciate it!!
thx
Chet
Quote from: ramset on October 19, 2013, 04:13:58 PM
Johan
Thanks for the info,I will be researching the lithium additive and greatly appreciate your offer to answer questions.
have you played with the lithium in an electrolyte to see if the gasses can evolve with less input energy?
thx
Chet
Hi Chet,
Sorry for the delay, to much nice work for a old guy ;-))
Lithium contained water for electrolyze, we are not using, because the lithium makes the water >PH.
This Lithium/Water in a ColdFushion with a camber like AtomicHydrogen is great, AirMotor behind it!
Regards, Johan
Quote from: ramset on October 20, 2013, 05:11:20 PM
Johan
All my Soaps are coming up Greasy ?
http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=lithium+soaps&id=82EE2F19760E3BF4866268A78B04F4F27138C7A5&FORM=IQFRBA (http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=lithium+soaps&id=82EE2F19760E3BF4866268A78B04F4F27138C7A5&FORM=IQFRBA)
Johan if you could give a link to this one
Qoute
Soap based on Lithium changes / lower this temp, to only 1000C, we pay 60 EURO Cents for a liter of this soap.
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I would greatly appreciate it!!
thx
Chet
Hi Chet,
We don't have a direct link for the soap, we are purchasing it low profil at a big Supermarket in Spain!
-------------
Like told: In the past we did have more than a bit contact with some different manufactories of soap, when they did hear for what we did use it, result: strange and very difficult behavior with a still non clear price setting, first they wanted to support there labor with a by us payed research, and a liter-price we did not get at the end!
Also experiences like that with a German-US company, in the past we did purchase lots of Peristaltic / dose-pumps, than our request for a different type for fuel use and delay and delay.
Will private mail you later a photo of a by us used Soap-Bottle!
Regards, Johan
Johan
Thank you for your reply.
Chet
Hi Johan:
I am from Spain, what is the name of the soap? is the name kh7?
thanks
Quote from: DOG on October 24, 2013, 11:03:47 AM
Hi Johan:
I am from Spain, what is the name of the soap? is the name kh7?
thanks
Hi Man,
Sorry for the delay, did miss the topic change announcement, old and busy!
With this below you find the AlCampo-Soap bottle photo, what we are using.
When you can not find these bottle's, just try A soap, and pre-mix it.
75% Diesel, 0.5-1% Soap, rest nice clean sweet water.
Test it in a simple diesel motor and straight compare the results.
A good soap for this, is giving with 20-25% mix, the same results as pure only diesel fuel.
The difference between 20 or 25%, is related to combustion camber shape, pre or direct.
Send you a PM, maybe we can see?
Regards, Johan
Johan
Old??
I hope the 1955 is not your birth year ?,if so you're still a young Man :D .
Thank you for sharing this very good information,I will share my findings!!
Nothing but grattitude from here!!
Chet
Quote from: ramset on December 16, 2013, 11:33:56 AM
Johan
Old??
I hope the 1955 is not your birth year ?,if so you're still a young Man :D .
Thank you for sharing this very good information,I will share my findings!!
Nothing but grattitude from here!!
Chet
Hi Chet,
Thanks, and sorry for the delay, if you also did wait for that photo!?
If you, or some need, ask!! To many nice projects! ;-))
---------------------
Fear for Emulsified Fuel:
There is far too much programmed fear around, induced from semi-advisors being: Hero or Senior member, so sorry also here!?
But here on Stefan's OU-Site, I feel always young, still a NEWBY, to little number of posts, so its not about the contents? ;-))
But its good and also in fully harmony with not mine but the sleeping outside world, leaded/dominated out of compensation.
The semi-advisors, when they here about: Emulsified Fuel, panic, mine Piezo-Injectors, if they knowing ......... ?
Piezo-Injector is just a more stupid injector, acting like a High-Pressure 2-2 ventiel, perfect for this with 1.8-2Kbar.
Diesel Fuel direct from EVERY pump, BP/Shell ....... contains water, this between a 2 - 4 % is very normal naturally, Benzine even more!
With this, not meaning the condens, that the to much water for the Diesel-Fuel to absorb, when its complete again, with the 2-4%.
---------------------
About Emulsified Fuel:
Sorry, our current movies are very basic, but now YT lets our account being there! ;-))
The previous account White coat, fully explaining step by step, movies are in space .......
About our current simple YT-OT-films, with the 40-50% savings: Same recept of Emulsified-Fuel.
Only with HHO-gas, produced by same engine, and a back-Feed from the Exhaust for more Temp.
---------------------
The last point of bringing Heat back is the biggest fuel saving: With our Heat-Recovery ;-))
When a motor has 10Kw, we use and produce 30Kw of Heat, only the piston-engine is still stupid design.
But with that 30Kw of Heat, you can do a lot: Google and build a Flash-Steam-Engine on you exhaust manifold.
This will double direct your engine Fuel-Economy from 30-35% to just over 60% efficiency.
Again: Google and learn about: Steam-engine's, build one behind your Big-Spender Piston Combustion waister!!
----------------------
We did make & tested a Rotary-Vane-Engine, posted before, is far better, bit fuel on a Large Diameter of Rotor, (Torque).
Next time ..................
All I can say: People, grape a old one-cilinder diesel: Hatz, Farymann, Lister, Petter, ................ and jump over your fear borders!
Get alive again, advisors are talking out of own fear, killing with that the free thinking creating artists!
Kind regards, Johan
""Get alive again, advisors are talking out of own fear, killing with that the free thinking creating artists!
Kind regards, Johan"""
-------------------------------------------------
Sir you truly inspire .
Yes the phase change from water to steam [and back again],is too good to pass up.
This will be a fun topic,and your contributions greatly appreciated.
after all we are not getting any younger......... :'(
but hopefully wiser :o
Tx
Chet
Hi Chet,
Thanks, but you got me at the moment from pure ............. , help!
Where is the true social behaviour in sharing, feelings & respect, know mine panic, bit like: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpYeekQkAdc
Most producing very passionate the new tax-payers, in and for a proven not working system, why addicted to XXX?
Claiming to love, but dumping them the product / kids fast a possible a school.
O yep, forgot, the mother needs also freedom, oeps, not forget the Gold-Card.
When you lucky in own choice / life, the contrasts becomes so, almost to clear!?
------------------
7 types of electrical charge / current, only one we can direct measure.
Why, we did get only the tools that they want, so use your upper compartiment and go for it!
------------------
Hoping that Luc has the patience, maybe one day they see even the good part of Ainslie/Gray/Papp ...........
Grape hammer, 2 rods in the soil, no, no, ...........
It has to go more easy, such spoiled & demanding towards a gift, of life?
------------------
Next time, a maybe more about our working Rotary-Plasma-Engine, yep, again and also with water!
Regards, Johan
Dear Johan_1955.
I have spent most of my life working with the Internal combustion engine, mainly the early ones !! I am also familiar with the use of water injection to reduce " Pinking " on Paraffin/kerosene engines.
I have also designed and built a few !!
Thought you might be interested in the following attachments taken from Rankin Kennedy's book " Modern engines and power generators 1905 "
I have often wondered how this would work scaled up ??
Cheers Grum.
Quote from: Grumage on December 17, 2013, 01:07:14 PM
Dear Johan_1955.
I have spent most of my life working with the Internal combustion engine, mainly the early ones !! I am also familiar with the use of water injection to reduce " Pinking " on Paraffin/kerosene engines.
I have also designed and built a few !!
Thought you might be interested in the following attachments taken from Rankin Kennedy's book " Modern engines and power generators 1905 "
I have often wondered how this would work scaled up ??
Cheers Grum.
Dear Grum,
Thanks for reacting!
Your "Pinking" = Detonation, in a Spark-plug engine?
Than your water injection, was maybe the Pre-Water Injection, like: http://www.aquamist.co.uk/
------------------
Thanks for the page's with "Vogt Engine", nice idea?
Only with the "Combustion-End-Pressure" on the hole engine casing, would it be possible with a Self Detonation / Diesel!?
But in the base, its like our solution for the Combined Dual Fuel Rotary Engine, we have a bit less water and smaller build, bit like a Liquid Ring Pump.
Regards, Johan
Quote from: Johan_1955 on December 18, 2013, 07:11:25 AM
Dear Grum,
Thanks for reacting!
Your "Pinking" = Detonation, in a Spark-plug engine?
Than your water injection, was maybe the Pre-Water Injection, like: http://www.aquamist.co.uk/
------------------
Thanks for the page's with "Vogt Engine", nice idea?
Only with the "Combustion-End-Pressure" on the hole engine casing, would it be possible with a Self Detonation / Diesel!?
But in the base, its like our solution for the Combined Dual Fuel Rotary Engine, we have a bit less water and smaller build, bit like a Liquid Ring Pump.
Regards, Johan
Dear Johan_1955.
Every time I read that "Water injection" will severely damage your engine I grit my teeth!! For nearly 30 years Lister Paraffin engines were fitted with a water injector, tapped off the cooling system.
Suggested rate was 1 drip per second set by looking through a glass window on the drip feed assembly !! Most of my larger Lister's are now at a museum. I can verify that the majority of my collection is still in perfect running order despite the vast quantities of water they consumed during their working life !!
"Pinking" or pre ignition knock was caused because the vaporised fuel had to be ignited at nearly 25 deg BTDC !! It was found that water injection cured this problem!! Back then fuel economy did not enter the equation !! :)
Cheers Grum.
Quote from: Grumage on December 18, 2013, 03:32:36 PM
Dear Johan_1955.
Every time I read that "Water injection" will severely damage your engine I grit my teeth!! For nearly 30 years Lister Paraffin engines were fitted with a water injector, tapped off the cooling system.
Suggested rate was 1 drip per second set by looking through a glass window on the drip feed assembly !! Most of my larger Lister's are now at a museum. I can verify that the majority of my collection is still in perfect running order despite the vast quantities of water they consumed during their working life !!
"Pinking" or pre ignition knock was caused because the vaporised fuel had to be ignited at nearly 25 deg BTDC !! It was found that water injection cured this problem!! Back then fuel economy did not enter the equation !! :)
Cheers Grum.
Hi Grum,
Don't grit your teeth about water-injection:
They come from school, knowing all better, history is simply proven is OLD, so can't work.
Beside to many only marketing teachers, running a class like a
Guantánamo Bay.[/size]
Teachers, willing to have groupies around them, for pleasing, was to much there.
We have simply to many: Non-Real writers, journalists, fashion driven, you know: Sterl., Dansing, ......
Your Lister, with the water feed from the cooling, smart warm water!
Was the cooling system filled with, anti-frost, Glycerine, that would create even some more burning benefit! ;-))
Pinking, thanks for explaining, was on the good knocking off-road, English is not my base!
----------
About Vogt-Engine:
Sorry, my reaction was to fast, its the perfect idea, for Pure only HHO, was to busy with mine state of building!
We know: Pure only HHO, has the huge contraction, this after the explosion.
Did do some years ago, good tests with a double-Acting, pneumatic cilinder, to use the + and the - in pressure state change.
Huge how the after explosion - pressure state is sucking in the Piston and rod, did not measure but massive force!
The Vogt-Engine: we could make 2 HHO-Cells directly on top of each side of the working piston, so in top of each of those 2-cil? cambers.
The flushing, pumping in the separate chambers is great for releasing the sticking HHO bubble's from the plate's.
No tube's, no back-flash or other fluide installation, its massive there where we need the HHO!! ;-)) THANKS!!
The use of HHO produced by the same engine, seems not economic, never did check it, time, but maybe so when we use both forces!?
We need thinking, fund raisers, with some marketing ability, but straight, maybe thats the base of current world problem?
THANKS, for making me dong, "the Engine contained HHO-Cell idea"! ;-))
Kind regards, Johan