Many claim the Francis turbine to be 82% efficient in energy conversion. Many others claim the Steam turbine to be 60% efficient.
Whenever steam/gas and water be in a container together, the water is the same pressure as the steam/gas and the steam/gas is the same pressure as the water.
Steam/gas will move water at the same pressure that the steam/gas is.
Steam/gas from behind pushing water through a Francis turbine converts 82% of the water flow into mechanical energy. Steam/gas from in front pushing water through a Francis turbine converts 82% of the water flow into mechanical energy. Steam/gas passing through a steam/gas turbine converts 60% of the steam/gas flow into mechanical energy.
Whatever steam pressure and volume you begin with you still have 100% of at the steam turbine.
Two conversions of 82% and one of 60% gives a total conversion of 222%. All of which comes from the original steam/gas generated in the boiler or elsewhere.
Three attempts made at removing the wrong attachment, three times the site refused to allow!
DaS Energy;
Your systematic, diagram based device proposals might well be considered to be *implementable
via 3D printing*. By using analogous systems that shift the temperature points of the working fluids
downward, one might be able to actually implement these systems for very low costs. One could then
incrementally improve the operation of subsystems by increasing device complexity only as needed.
The thermal conductivity of plastic materials could be increased via metal inserts. You would then be able
to validate the theoretical math as you proceed. I generally like the idea of being able to go from theoretics
to physical test systems in a seemless , inexpensive and incremental fashion.
:S:MarkSCoffman
Wrong. Taking the numbers as given:
The first "82 percent efficient conversion" yields (input power x 0.82) = output power.
The second "82 percent" yields output power = (0.82 x 0.82) x input power.
The third "60 percent" yields output power = (0.82 x 0.82 x 0.60) x input power.
For a total output power of a little over 40 percent of the input power.
You cannot add or multiply or chain together individual processes that are each "under unity" or less than 100 percent efficiency, and wind up with something that is OU!
Bloke once saw an elephant and spent the rest of his life denying there be such animal.
Quote from: DaS Energy on December 12, 2013, 06:18:44 PM
Bloke once saw an elephant and spent the rest of his life denying there be such animal.
Is that a refutation of my posting? Or is it another off-topic, dataless, left-handed insult?
Please show how a number of "underunity" stages can be chained in order to produce an overunity result. Builders who have the knowledge and means to test efficiencies would really like to know.
Hello all,
Follow the drawing.
Solid black lines define the containment vessel.
Solid blue line is the water moving out and the broken blue line the water moving back.
Red line is either air, steam or gas.
Filled in circles represent balls.
Filled in triangles are one way valves directing the water in direction of point.
Filled in grey black lines are small diameter pipes.
Requirements for build are pipes, an 82% efficient impulse turbine, a 60% efficient air, steam, or gas turbine, plus two DaS Valves.
Enough volume of air, steam or gas is required to rotate a turbine 360*. Having obtained that in the boiler, the hydro turbine is rotated 720* and the air, steam, or gas turbine is rotated 360*.
The 164% efficient design can be attached to any air, steam or gas line without effecting its volume or pressure.
Efficiency rating of the turbines is that supplied by the maker.
Peter