This one has it all except unknown power density. Behaves like a cap.
http://revolution-green.com/aluminium-battery-from-stanford/
Lets hope this is the real deal
Mark
Makes me think of Robert Murray-Smith's new SuperCapacitor technology using aluminum and graphene ink. Who knows, maybe the Stanford team is "borrowing" ideas from him. After all, the only graphite material they could possibly be using in a flexible battery IS graphene. Any other form of graphite other than loose powder would snap with the slightest amount of flex. I can't remember exactly what Robert is using for his electrolyte, but that may be the ONLY difference between Stanford's battery and Robert's. If it's close to the same, Stanford can forget about a patent!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iD2rVGjG2HQ
I knew this was going to happen like 5 years ago already.the demand for quik-charge on cellular phones is going to kick Li-ions out the scene soon just watch.aluminum is way cheaper than lithium too
At last the problem of batteries catching fire when you drill through them has been licked! We'll all be able to sleep well tonight.
= Bill
Are we to believe that this amounts to a sheet of Al wrapped around a rod of carbon (part of a welding rod) with a bit of cloth soaked in salty water in between?
Quote from: Paul-R on April 08, 2015, 12:14:26 PM
Are we to believe that this amounts to a sheet of Al wrapped around a rod of carbon (part of a welding rod) with a bit of cloth soaked in salty water in between?
It's not quite that simple..
Check out the link to Robert Murray-Smith's video that I posted above. If you want to try it for yourself, he goes thru everything step by step in videos (look in his playlists for the vids to make the graphene, electrolyte, and anything else you might need to know how to do).
The only thing that is semi-complex in the process is making the graphene.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3027399/The-battery-recharges-MINUTE-Experts-build-cheap-flexible-power-pack-aluminium.html
I see a major problem with the claim of charging a phone battery in under 1 minute. The charger. For example my phone has a 2.53 amp hour battery. that means, if (rounding the battery size to 2.5 amp hour) I convert to amp minutes so I can see how many amps would be required to charge the battery in one minute. So that's 2.5 amp hours x 60 minutes = 150 amp minutes, so that would mean if I wanted to charge the battery in one minute I would need to cause 150 amps to the phone.
Not only will it require thick cables but also a powerful charger, if the charging voltage is 5 volts then 5v times 150A is 750 Watts.
And the charger would be taking over three amps at 240 volts from the wall.
So to charge this beast battery in under 1 minute would require almost 1 Horsepower.
Now that is something I would like to see happen. :)
I would think 5 amps would be a fast enough rate to charge at. That would charge the battery in 30 minutes.
There can be an advantage to using a low charge current on a phone in use in a car on charge, so that the phone runs from the power supply and just keeps the battery at nominal voltage.
Having said that any battery that replaces lithium with aluminium has got to be good even if it take the same or even longer to charge.
Anyone else agree the 1 minute charge thing is a bit radical ?
..
Quote from: Farmhand on April 08, 2015, 10:24:10 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-3027399/The-battery-recharges-MINUTE-Experts-build-cheap-flexible-power-pack-aluminium.html
I see a major problem with the claim of charging a phone battery in under 1 minute. The charger. For example my phone has a 2.53 amp hour battery. that means, if (rounding the battery size to 2.5 amp hour) I convert to amp minutes so I can see how many amps would be required to charge the battery in one minute. So that's 2.5 amp hours x 60 minutes = 150 amp minutes, so that would mean if I wanted to charge the battery in one minute I would need to cause 150 amps to the phone.
Not only will it require thick cables but also a powerful charger, if the charging voltage is 5 volts then 5v times 150A is 750 Watts.
And the charger would be taking over three amps at 240 volts from the wall.
So to charge this beast battery in under 1 minute would require almost 1 Horsepower.
Now that is something I would like to see happen. :)
I would think 5 amps would be a fast enough rate to charge at. That would charge the battery in 30 minutes.
There can be an advantage to using a low charge current on a phone in use in a car on charge, so that the phone runs from the power supply and just keeps the battery at nominal voltage.
Having said that any battery that replaces lithium with aluminium has got to be good even if it take the same or even longer to charge.
Anyone else agree the 1 minute charge thing is a bit radical ?
..
Hm, I never really considered that part of the whole 1 minute charge situation... you're right, though, at least on paper. What they must be saying is that the little single layer cell he's holding in his hands takes about one minute to charge.... but how long would an equivalent lithium ion cell take? two minutes, three?? There is a severe lack of information in that article now that you mention it. I've been wanting to attempt making my own aluminum-graphene cells from Robert's instructions, but I do not have the materials or means to make the graphene yet, so I have zero experience on this specific matter. I have far too much else to focus on atm to be worrying about trying to make my own supercaps or cells.
Thinking a little bit deeper into it, though, brings up the fact that an aluminum graphene/"graphite" cell would act much more like a super capacitor than a cell. Doesn't that mean it could be pulse-charged with a voltage higher than it's meant to put out, and "step it down" into less voltage/more current? Just for numbers sake, 100V@10A = 25V@40A, correct? Either way you look at that, you have 1000 Watts of power.
So, for nice round numbers, let's say we want our cell battery to put out 4V @ 1000mAh (1Ah), or 4V @ 60,000mAmin (60Amin) - if we are able to charge at a higher voltage and let the chemical reaction "step it down" for us like a sort-of transformer, we could charge it at 40V, 6Amps for 1 minute - we would have our full-size cell phone battery charged in about one minute. IF it works that way......
No no robert murray-smith is dealing with non-redox capacitors.stanford is dealing with redox electrochemistry of aluminum its completely different.aluminum is functioning exactly the same as lithium in the Li-ion bats:Li> Li+ + e-/ Al> Al3+ + 3e-. Until now nobody could get more than a hanful charge-discharge cycles going with aluminum but now they got it up to 7000 cycles.and very fast too.they're going to make billions of dollars because its 1)cheaper 2)faster 3)safer than Li-ion.voltage is slightly less though at about 2v versus 3v of the Li-ions but this is no problem.
Capacitors lose potential whereas a storage battery is able to maintain potential.
This means that for a capacitor to be useful as a storage device voltage control will
be required.
I read an article years ago about a hypothetical system for cars. Your car would have a big aluminum battery that might last a month (I think). Then you would drive to a shop and they would swap out your expended battery for a fresh one. The expended battery would be recharged at the shop with specialized equipment.
That sounds pretty reasonable. I would not be surprised that if you did a little digging you would find a dozen or more "aluminum battery breakthrough" stories over the past five years. Hopefully one day a viable system will reach commercial production.
You just have to put on your engineering hat for the issue of fast charging for aluminum cell phone batteries. You could redesign the battery pack and put a big rectangular contact on each side of the battery that's say six square centimeters in size. Then your high current charging is not an issue.
You are at Starbucks and you want to recharge your battery. With this phone the thin rectangular battery is pushed into a slot and clicks into place like some giant SD memory card. You pop out the battery and you insert it into the slot of a battery charging machine. As it is drawn into the slot a roller wipes the two contacts clean. You wait a minute and the fully charged battery pops out and then you slide it back into your phone. The smart high-current charger does not over charge your aluminum battery and then does a wireless debit charge to - your phone. That incentivizes some bars and restaurants to offer free instant charging to attract customers. (And collect junk email addresses!)
Quote from: MileHigh on April 09, 2015, 10:48:56 AM
Your car would have a big aluminum battery
Some car bodies are themselves aluminium. The battery could be integral.
'Some car bodies are themselves aluminium. The
battery could be integral'
let's hope the breaks system isn't part of that integral
Mile:' read an article years ago about a hypothetical
system for cars. Your car would have a big
aluminum battery that might last a month (I think)'
Forget about this just use a continuous aluminum/air fuel cell.when you finish your beer just dump the can in the hood and that gives you an extra 2miles.replace the caustic soda electrolyte once a month
I can just imagine you integral car as a heap of white dust !!
'I can just imagine you integral car as a heap of white
dust !!'
After-effects of the ensuing thermite reaction lol