I do not know to write correctly in English. But I would like to share an idea of magnetic and gravitational motor. It is inspired in stirling engine of the address http://www.rotarystirlingengines.com/sexbaloon.htm .
The motor is based on repulses of magnets. It provokes displacement of water when compressing balloons. Thus the weight of the wheel always is dislocated for a side of it, making to turn it.
I made an animated gif to illustrate its possible (or impossible) functioning.
Could this motor to work?
A few questions come to mind.
What will allow the water to equalize again after its cycle?
How will the magnets be able to push the water from one balloon to another fast enough upon initial contact of the magnets before inertia of the wheel cycles past the magnets alltogether?
I think with some modifications it "could" work but I believe it would have to be huge to create any kind of useable torque. I also think it would rotate rather slowly... much like a paddlewheel.
Cool concept though! =)
I am thankful for the answers. The motor is a mere basic idea. I do not know not even as to calculate the related forces. I only know that it can be a way to unbalance the wheel.
What I would like to know is if the energy necessary to unbalance the wheel (the entrance of the magneto of the balloon in the field of the fixed magneto) is fewer than the energy supplied by the movement of the unbalanced wheel.
Hi ya:
I kind of feel that when the 3 oclock side pushes the water to the 9 oclock
side and it rotates to the bottom, the excess water will want to stay there. Then
it happens again only to rotate downward but this time there will be more water
in the bottom to lift and should only rise to half the distance from 6 up to 3. Just
my thoughts
sugra
just might work better if the outer magnet is between 4-5 oclock. the water will come to equilibrium in both sides, but the magnet will be there to push the water out. who knows, really you have to build it.
peace
I drew a new cofigura??o. A bicycle tire can be used.
Joao,
This looks very clever and simple!
Two wheels may be the way to go; it would help add some Chaos.
It shouldn't be too hard to build a prototype.
Great idea.
Excellent Joao!
I have just done my 4th wheel here and loading it with springs to try get the same effect..
Never thought of using a tyre and adjusting the pressure to suit, maybe one to play with next.
Regards
Sean.
sorry.. i don't think it will work the repulsion from the others magnets will stop the wheel from moving. the magnets above and below will repulse from the center.. and will "balance" the wheel... my oppinion.. but I think you have to do it.. because the best way to try it's testing.
regards
I was thinking on the motor "B", and I arrived to conclusion that it does not work. The water, by no having points of ?support? inside of the wheel, will adapt to the total form of the wheel and the water will not transfer its weight to an only side of the wheel.
But the motor "A" still seems promising. It could be like the following figure:
Joao,
This was expressed earlier. Assuming a free flow of liquid is required between the reservoirs; what will keep the fluid from flowing into the lower area and making the whole wheel bottom heavy?
(//)
ResinRat2,
In the stirling engine from http://www.rotarystirlingengines.com/sexbaloon.htm , occurs the same thing to the water, but the engine realy work.
The stirling engine:
To the motor C, could be similar to above stirling engine (the water flux what unbalance the wheel is the red arrow):
Joao,
Thanks for the info. Looking at it from that point of view it does help to unbalance the wheel in the right direction.
Why not just use the weight of the magnets themselves? or the added weight of a sliding rotor.
If the magnets are connected to a rod with a fixed length and allowed to slide closer to the center of the wheel the weight will become unbalanced. Here's a very crappy drawing:
(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthumb9.webshots.net%2Ft%2F18%2F18%2F9%2F44%2F31%2F2386944310096770189pxwThR_th.jpg&hash=328738167ea3499f5d78c248bac78dded2602eda) (http://home-and-garden.webshots.com/photo/2386944310096770189pxwThR)
This doesn't have as many rotors as a final product would, but it should give an idea. The magnets on the right hand side are being pushed to the center of the wheel causing the wheel to become unbalanced. Gravity naturally rotates the wheel counter-clock wise which forces the next rotor into position. I don't know if the rotors will have to be connected to the rotor of the opposite side or if just forcing the magnets on the right hand side of the wheel to the center would be enough to unbalance the wheel.
Think of each rotor set as a lever. For instance....In the picture above the rotors at 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock are one lever in the system and the center of the wheel is the fulcrum. When everything is centered they are balanced. However if you push the magnet of the 3 o'clock rotor towards the fulcrum you change the balance to be heavier at the 9 o'clock side of the lever. This is accomplished by 1 of 2 ways. The 3 and 9 rotors are actually 1 solid rotor that is allowed to slide back and forth adding extra weight to the 9 side when it is pushed by the repulsive magnet stators. Or they are 2 independent shafts that are made of 2 seperate pieces per rotor. The 2 pieces would be sized so that one could slide it the other similar to a radio antenna. There wouldn't be any added mass to the left side of the wheel in the seperate rotor setup, only a change in the distrobution of the weight on the right.
kind of reminds me of http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,240.msg1664.html#msg1664
i like yours better :)
seems simple and could work.
peace
also have you guys seem this other magnet-gravity wheel? http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,894.0.html
peace
The reason to use water is because it make possible, by a little movement of the magnets, to dislocate a bigger mass than to use only the movement and weight of the magnets. This is perhaps what it is necessary for the gravity force of the dislocated weight become bigger than force necessary to the magnets enter in the repulsive field of the outer magnet. However it may be, all the ideas are goods, and could be to be tested.
Quote from: FreeEnergy on October 12, 2006, 10:45:50 PM
kind of reminds me of http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,240.msg1664.html#msg1664
i like yours better :)
seems simple and could work.
peace
&
also have you guys seem this other magnet-gravity wheel? http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,894.0.html
peace
I hadn't ever seen the "Axletree" machine before.....i'm a newbie and haven't gone thru the boards yet.
However, it doesn't look to me like it would work. The wheel isn't becoming unbalanced by the way it is described. The axles on his setup are being pushed back up before they hit the 6 o'clock position on his wheel which doesn't allow them to use all of their momentum and adds counter weight opposite to the rotation. At the earliest the axles should be forced to the other side of the wheel after the 6 o'clock position to keep from adding any extra weight behind the 12 o'clock position.
Depending on the direction of rotation, the stator magnets should only be positioned from 6 o'clock to 3 o'clock(counter-clock) or 9 o'clock(clockwise). If you try to push the axles back too soon you are being counter productive.
The other wheel definately couldn't work with a single stator magnet in attraction. It may work with multiple stators in repulsion instead. When the arms "dip" down they can use gravity to get within the field of the repulsing stator magnets and have a track of them similar to the Axletree to carry the wheel to the position where the next arm slides out. However, this setup is too complicated. If one of the tracks that the arms slide on gets stuck then the wheel stops.
Joao,
I was looking at your Motor B and thought the inclusion of one way valves would help control the water flow to one side of the wheel, thus unbalancing the water mass to one side. This is just an idea to throw out. I know the drawing is not too good but I think you get the idea. I also rotated the wheel thirty degrees or so to help favor one side when the magnet forces the water out.
Thoughts anyone?
(//)
Excellent idea! Perhaps it can facilitate to build prototipes to test by using hoses with valves. The only matter is that it make necessary that the repulsive force of de magnets have to stay near to derection of the gravity force, near vertical. This situation cold diminish the theoretical potency of the intersection between gravity force and magnetic force (surely, the ideal angle is 90 degree or less).
Quote from: juspot82 on October 12, 2006, 12:11:25 PM
Why not just use the weight of the magnets themselves? or the added weight of a sliding rotor.
If the magnets are connected to a rod with a fixed length and allowed to slide closer to the center of the wheel the weight will become unbalanced. Here's a very crappy drawing:
(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthumb9.webshots.net%2Ft%2F18%2F18%2F9%2F44%2F31%2F2386944310096770189pxwThR_th.jpg&hash=328738167ea3499f5d78c248bac78dded2602eda) (http://home-and-garden.webshots.com/photo/2386944310096770189pxwThR)
This doesn't have as many rotors as a final product would, but it should give an idea. The magnets on the right hand side are being pushed to the center of the wheel causing the wheel to become unbalanced. Gravity naturally rotates the wheel counter-clock wise which forces the next rotor into position. I don't know if the rotors will have to be connected to the rotor of the opposite side or if just forcing the magnets on the right hand side of the wheel to the center would be enough to unbalance the wheel.
Think of each rotor set as a lever. For instance....In the picture above the rotors at 3 o'clock and 9 o'clock are one lever in the system and the center of the wheel is the fulcrum. When everything is centered they are balanced. However if you push the magnet of the 3 o'clock rotor towards the fulcrum you change the balance to be heavier at the 9 o'clock side of the lever. This is accomplished by 1 of 2 ways. The 3 and 9 rotors are actually 1 solid rotor that is allowed to slide back and forth adding extra weight to the 9 side when it is pushed by the repulsive magnet stators. Or they are 2 independent shafts that are made of 2 seperate pieces per rotor. The 2 pieces would be sized so that one could slide it the other similar to a radio antenna. There wouldn't be any added mass to the left side of the wheel in the seperate rotor setup, only a change in the distrobution of the weight on the right.
did a little mod to the Axletree wheel. :P
FreeEnergy,
Now I really like that one. I'm not sure how you would design the middle axle, since all the magnet/sticks need to go through the center in good balance. Yours looks much simpler to build (except for the middle).
I'm curious to see what idea you might have for the axle/ center design.
Interesting innovation.
Thinking about the wheel with the one-way valves; I don't believe it would be very easy to build, although using a hose and fittings is an idea. (thanks Joao). The fittings would not allow compression in the places where the valves would be. This might allow water to collect in certain areas and not move to the next chaimber. The valves would have to be as easily compressable as the rest of the hose. I'm not sure this is possible.
Oh well, back to the brainstorming.
had another idea (with and without magnets), imagen the extending arms being air pockets and the whole wheel would be underwater. no?
ofcourse it would rotate the opposite way