EDIT: 1 picture which includes all 3 drawings
Hello to all,
this is my first post in this forum. in the past I found a russian site, which contains a very simple magnetmotordesign. Unfortunatually I cant remember the sites name and I dont speak Russian. At that time I only saved the pictures, but its easy to understand. I can only attach 1 picture, so I packed the 3 pictures in a gif-animation, so they appear one after another.
What do you think about it?
Have a nice day!
M.
Have you attempted any replication?
How do you get the gif-animation to pause?
Hi
Who can read what they are saying?
Thks
@Kysmett
No, but I will do it, because its so simple.
@Cisco
I made the gif-animation in Picture Publisher and in the menu I choose the time how long a picture appears.
@magpower
I dont know what they are saying, but at the bottom there is a ringmagnet as stator and above thera are 2 diskmagnets as rotor. The diskmagnets want to move (rotate around their own axles) with their southpoles to the northpole of the bottom ringmagnet, but they cant, because they are fixed on the rotor, so the rotor have to rotate - at least this is the idea behind it. To clarify the priniple, I attached a selfmade simple picture, only with the magnets.
Greetings
M.
Hi,
you can simply attach one picture to every reply,
so please reattach the single pics to a reply over here please.
How are the rotor magnets magnetized ?
This is not clear to me...
Thanks.
Regards, Stefan.
The device assumes facts not in evidence.....the field interactions as displayed are based on conjecture.? In a manner somewhat similar to the way that 'gears' bind when improperly coupled, so too this arrangement, I am certain, will not work.
In a small way, It is akin to the overbalancing assumption being made here:
(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.todayinsci.com%2FBooks%2FMechApp%2Fchap23%2F934-RollingRing.jpg&hash=1c8507bd155925fca87086ff0685954556b1ddec)
Working with magnetic fields for the purposes of extracting mechanical rotational energies, requires a careful consideration of tangential forces and axial displacement.
Elsewise,? one can easily get lost in a quagmire of subtleties.
Peace,
TS
The machine won't work, it's static (or whats the english term?).
In magnetmotor.gif the machine turns the wrong way, attraction is stronger than repulsion.
@pinobot
No, its not the wrong way. I thought that too, but its correct.
M.
I surmise that this device may have culminated from research on HJ's work.....a clever iteration that seeks to avoid the 'pitfalls' of HJ's rotary patent.? Instead, seeking to provide a smooth, uninterrupted orbital track.
If I didn't know better,? I would have to conclude that HJ's, this, and several other published devices were introduced simply to facilitate the work of 'others'......saying it, without actually saying it, perhaps.
Many forces at work here.
TS
This is simple enough to test even in the middle of my home moving. I will look for parts tomorrow, hopefully between the moving and the testing I will be free to post results on Sunday, if not on Monday. I have a feeling that I am not accounting for something, but this is one of those things that I could work for a week to find the loophole, or spend a half hour building it and come to the same conclusion. If it doesn't work, then I'll spend the week thinking about why, and if it does then whoopee I have a new house and a new working concept (which I will probably have to spend more than a week making useful). Either way the next week is shot. ;D
Very intriguing, this little guy.? For those seeking replication.....discard the 'field line' graphic and go by feel using your own scale.??There's an intriguing field coupling sweet spot in there......sphere magnets may present a more advantageous field geometry for use as 'satellite' magnets.
Also, using a larger, ceramic speaker ring magnet and smaller neos may be a good starting point and it appears given the scale shown in the graphic that this may be what was used in the Russian model.
It also appears that a variable central axis may be intentional.? Interesting at least.? Much to read between the 'lines'.....as usual.
Peace,
TS
I now have the magnets (all NdFeB): one 50 x 10 mm diskmagnet as stator and two 23 x 2 mm diskmagnets as rotor. They are very strong and if you hold one of the rotormagnets with your hands at the right place near the big statormagnet, you can feel a very strong force in one direction. When it is build, I will tell you the results.
M.
M
I had a shot at this using speaker 3" dia and 3/8" dia. I could get 180 turn but seemed a sticky spot here. and always at same spot. Haven't given up and there might be more to it. What link do you find this. Really it should work.
May the 'force' be with you.....or should I say: Forces......
TS
Why don't you set it up similar to an electric motor?? Instead of having the magnets back to back though, set them up like a curved shoe. A large magnet and a smaller one at the other endboth with opposite polarities. Of course the smaller one would have to be slighty slanted to create a pulling force rather than just stabilising the whole thing and causing it to move in a certain direction. That way you can change speed with which you want it to run.
As for the problem with magnets losing there magnetivity, why not try using electromagnets? ;) You could use some spill off electricity from what your generating with it. Sure it would need some power to start it all off, but at least you wont have to worry about the magnets burning out! 8)
another avi symulation .
regards AW
Hello all,
I'm the one who made that video that budinst posted. I built a test model of it which did not work, but I believe I know why. In order for there to be any movement, there has to be an imbalance of forces on either side of the rotor. If you really think about it, on either side of one of the rotor magnet, there is the same amount of North Pole coming from the disk magnet as on the other side. So, though the rotor magnet is immersed in a North Pole field, there is no gradient of force from one side of the rotor magnet to the other. My thought about this is perhaps the rotor magnet needs to be more directly exposed to the pole face of the disk magnet. So that the flux lines will not be bending downward towards the disk and creating a torsion force, but actually pulling and pushing the magnet around the rotor. We have to pay close attention to which way the flux lines want to drag the magnet. From the drawings I have seen with the flux lines and the simulations I have doner, it looks more like the lines are curving right down into the pole face.
God Bless,
Jason O
There was also another replication by Ron here. His also did not work but we got the same sort of sticky effects.
very simple not work :) see movie
regards AW
my experiment very simple not work
AW
Someone said earlier that the magnetic force was too 'equal' on both sides.... Why not split the ring magnets into many pieces, an odd number to be sure, so that spacing between the pieces can give you an imbalance at all times?
Quote from: kenbo0422 on May 14, 2005, 09:39:21 PM
Someone said earlier that the magnetic force was too 'equal' on both sides.... Why not split the ring magnets into many pieces, an odd number to be sure, so that spacing between the pieces can give you an imbalance at all times?
Thats a thought, and it could work that way. What you are really creating in that case is a TOMI like effect, only the pole setup is reversed. On the TOMI, the magnet has notches and the polarity of each little notch is like the rotor magnets, and the rotor itself has a magnet with a single pole facing the base. It's the same idea. Both have not been disproven and from some of the different tests I've seen, there have been some very interesting effects. The big question that no one has answered yet is if a true tomi closed loop works yet. (at least as far as I know anyway). Here's some more information on it here: http://peswiki.com/index.php/Directory:Magnetic_Motors:PM3.
Also, here's a video that David Rutchik made showing some experiments he did with the TOMI. Don't be fooled, this is not a SMOT or anything: http://www.fdp.nu/linearmotion/default.asp
Ken,? lucid observation as usual.
A timed magnetic imbalance can be effected by the stacking of High saturation ferromagnetic materials, ie. annealed soft iron, wound with very fine, high purity insulated copper situated on a magnet of the proper field geometry, interacting with other magnets.
A simple pyramid or cone magnet can be made to display a highly non symmetric field geometry which can be useful for many purposes.
The magnetic beam amplifier as displayed in the Lockheed patent can, and I am sure, has been improved upon in many ways.....a useful 'imbalance'....if commensurately weak compared to what can be accomplished by the use of high efficiency EMs.
I read recently of two neutron stars witnessed to become what is believed to be a Black Hole.....their quickening orbital pirouette ending in quite a show......
Basically...the creation of a kind of inverse, magnetogravitic dipole...on contact.
Imagine an exotic supermagnet much like a hollow sphere, of one polarity on the outside and one on the inside.....with a hole on each side.? Is that wild or what? The flux strings squirting out each hole would act as a conduit, a conductive sheath for high energy beams, as such has been observed.
Matter would be shuttled quickly to the holes and drawn in and processed in an instant.? It's no wonder that light can't escape a field comprised largely of the 'ether' itself....tied into such a 'knot'.
So, while there will certainly be a 'kind' of? interaction between the ether of free space and that comprising the field of the 'black hole'.....the ultrathin 'membrane' separating the two is maintained by the matter cotinually being processed such that this interaction would appear, to the outside observer, to be subtle indeed.....if at all.? ;)
One wonders whether such 'inverse dipoles' (for lack of a better description at the moment) can be exactingly engineered to 'pop' into existence on a micro scale, with enough stability to be of any serviceable knowledge.
One might even say that 'black holes' are the 'maintenance generators' of the fabric of our reality......popping up wherever they are needed to help offset and equalize localized etheric densities of sufficient disparity from normalized space to warrant such an engineered self correcting mechanism.
I'll stop here for now.
And I know, I know......Speaking of ether....
Buddum Bum.
8)
Quote from: m668004 on April 28, 2005, 01:15:47 PM
EDIT: 1 picture which includes all 3 drawings
Hello to all,
this is my first post in this forum. in the past I found a russian site, which contains a very simple magnetmotordesign. Unfortunatually I cant remember the sites name and I dont speak Russian. At that time I only saved the pictures, but its easy to understand. I can only attach 1 picture, so I packed the 3 pictures in a gif-animation, so they appear one after another.
What do you think about it?
Have a nice day!
M.
this is not working
there is no mag field change to give it a reason to move one mm.
this is the same
http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/shpmm.htm
It has been made and tested it doesn't move a bit. Reason is if you look at field at one position and in any other position in 360deg there is no field change so there is no reason for it to move.
m668004 "What do you think about it?"
- It's written there that it won't work as it is, till you do something with a stator. It's kind of puzzle they suggested to solve. Solving the puzzle allow to build a selfrunnung PMM.
QuoteAlso, here's a video that David Rutchik made showing some experiments he did with the TOMI. Don't be fooled, this is not a SMOT or anything: http://www.fdp.nu/linearmotion/default.asp
Sorry, might be a bit off topic but...
Has anybody ever thought of this model but then in a circular way? Could be cewl... ;)
Hi All,
Have you seen this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzkCOmdfh5c
I think the basic is there, only now how to make it stable and workable.
Regards,
Hi,
@ xilusma
I am 100% sure it slowed down and that is the only reason it slowly lost its impulse the "inventor" gave it at startup.
@ Aerny
Yes it has been tested in a circular arrangement by some other experimenters and it simple did not work, unfortunately. In that arrangement, only the linear 'track' works. Maybe building a very long track (say 10m, but I really do not know how long would be good) and then slowly bending it gradually towards a circle would be worth trying. (it would need an awful lot of magnets)
Gyula
Hi Gyula,
Might be you're right, it slow down after the startup spin.
But what if, the spin is stop due to the of unbalanced from the spin magnet.
I think, it might be the same principle that the Chinese's inventor motor is having and the Russian's site is all about.
And if anybody want to experiment further, I think the additional thing that they need to look into is the balancer. Just like the Chinese's invention, he did mentioned that he need to have some sort of balancer for it to keep moving and avoid the "lock" spot.
Regards,