Has this ever been considered?
What about a single SMOT ramp that has a return ramp. In other words a simple ramp that returns tha ball to it's starting position.
It should catch the ball at the drop off point, run around the ramp at a downward angle and return the ball to starting position.
I've created a simple drawing of what I have in mind: (https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg179.imageshack.us%2Fimg179%2F2646%2Fsmotwithreturnrampmb6.jpg&hash=46f50b2e01869dd4c70ceb22576bf02ca930e605)
the magnets would screw it up...
maybe if you could tap some of the gravity energy while the ball is falling and use it in the last leg to make it reach back to the starting position.
Surely, this will work if the ball is returned to the bottom
of the SMOT ramp AT THE RIGHT SPEED. This may involve
quite a lot of fiddling, but it is important.
Alternatively, the ball could roll down the slope, and when it
is at the right speed, find another SMOT ramp which you
have thoughtfully put there.
Paul.
I admit it's perhaps a bit far fetched to try this with just one SMOT, but it becomes more feasible when you link three or four SMOTs in line, each next ramp positioned a bit higher than the previous one.
The drop-off after the last SMOT should then be high enough to escape the magnet field and return to the starting point, perhaps even with a curved return-ramp. I mean curved in the horizontal plane to stay out of reach of the SMOT magnets.
Like so:
(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg504.imageshack.us%2Fimg504%2F9524%2Flinkedsmotswithreturnrael0.gif&hash=6773419d1c7b42331496da5c4fa9adca4fadd574) (http://imageshack.us)
By vikingdread (http://profile.imageshack.us/user/vikingdread) at 2007-07-10
P.S. As this is a side projection it is not possible to show the curve of the return-ramp in the horizontal plane.
You are on the right track. Others are pumping energy in to get
mega performance, but your track is more scientifically elegant:
http://www.sussex.ac.uk/press_office/bulletin/22oct99/article1.html
http://www.sussex.ac.uk/press_office/bulletin/02may97/item9.html
Paul.
Quote from: vikingdread on July 10, 2007, 02:45:28 PM
Sorry, somehow the link to the animated GIF got mixed up, the correct URL is:
(https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg504.imageshack.us%2Fimg504%2F9524%2Flinkedsmotswithreturnrael0.th.gif&hash=1dd9f08495d7990eaaddc592c460c8899c7e9ab4) (http://img504.imageshack.us/i/linkedsmotswithreturnrael0.gif/)
P.S. As this is a side projection it is not possible to show the curve of the return-ramp in the horizontal plane.
Quote from: vikingdread on July 09, 2007, 02:12:13 PM
Has this ever been considered?
What about a single SMOT ramp that has a return ramp. In other words a simple ramp that returns tha ball to it's starting position.
It should catch the ball at the drop off point, run around the ramp at a downward angle and return the ball to starting position.
I've created a simple drawing of what I have in mind: (https://overunityarchives.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg179.imageshack.us%2Fimg179%2F2646%2Fsmotwithreturnrampmb6.jpg&hash=46f50b2e01869dd4c70ceb22576bf02ca930e605)
What often is forgotten is that during demo's people start rolling magnets beyond the first resistance point, so the demo's start with a positive offset of energy.
Simply closing the loop will not work because when entering the start position again the moving magnet has to bridge the remaining force that has been skipped earlier
Quote from: robbie47 on September 07, 2009, 05:40:37 AM
What often is forgotten is that during demo's people start rolling magnets beyond the first resistance point, so the demo's start with a positive offset of energy.
Simply closing the loop will not work because when entering the start position again the moving magnet has to bridge the remaining force that has been skipped earlier
Very true and often overlooked. You still need energy to get the ball starting in the smot and your ball rolling back down will not have enough energy to re-enter.
Quote from: wattsup on September 07, 2009, 08:16:01 AM
Very true and often overlooked. You still need energy to get the ball starting in the smot and your ball rolling back down will not have enough energy to re-enter.
Just wondering:
Would the energy needed for re-entry be enough if you had 20, 30 or even a hundred linked SMOTs?
Is it theoretically possible to link SMOTs infinitely?
Quote from: vikingdread on September 07, 2009, 08:26:09 AM
Just wondering:
Would the energy needed for re-entry be enough if you had 20, 30 or even a hundred linked SMOTs?
Is it theoretically possible to link SMOTs infinitely?
My personal feeling is a 'no'. There are always friction losses.
There is a guy on the internet called 'soukop' that claims to have solved the 'point of return' issue.
His you-tube channel can be found here: http://www.youtube.com/my_subscriptions?pi=0&ps=20&sf=added&sa=0&sq=&dm=2&s=QcqAIEx3zjA&as=1 (http://www.youtube.com/my_subscriptions?pi=0&ps=20&sf=added&sa=0&sq=&dm=2&s=QcqAIEx3zjA&as=1)
He has mentioned he solved the issue with applying materials that cause eddy currents at certain area's of his motor concept. If this is true (he is a strange guy with some high-delusion behaviour) I assume he is mounting some metal parts in the area of the 'point of return'.
If you want to research this problem I would advise you to look into this first, it is an interesting point of view so solve this issue with the help of local eddy current effects.
He also mentioned that he has patented his motor and that it would be public quite soon.
I tried linking a bunch of them together a long time ago:
http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/smot/smotmk1/smotmk1.htm
But I have to agree with robbie47. When you position the ball at
the beginning it is like you are compressing the ball against a
spring and when you release the ball, the spring decompresses,
giving the ball a push. When the energy of that push is exhausted
in losses, the ball stops. The spring in this case is the magnets'
pull on the ball while you hold it at the starting position. When you
release the ball that potential energy is turned into kinetic energy
which eventually exhausts itself.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org http://wsminfo.org
Quote from: Steven Dufresne on September 07, 2009, 01:04:27 PM
I tried linking a bunch of them together a long time ago:
http://rimstar.org/sdenergy/smot/smotmk1/smotmk1.htm
http://rimstar.org http://wsminfo.org
Hi Steven,
Thanks for the very complete answer. May I ask where you purchased your steel balls and magnets?
Quote from: vikingdread on September 08, 2009, 03:58:46 AM
Thanks for the very complete answer. May I ask where you purchased your steel balls and magnets?
Hi vikingdread,
They were from a local industrial supply store that sells ball bearings and other types of bearings. Look up bearing suppliers in your local yellow pages. Failing that, try bearings in ebay or google.
-Steve
http://rimstar.org http://wsminfo.org
how about something like this.
the sensor detects the ball at the end of the magnetic array and turns on the solenoid coil and the ball is sensed on the output side of the solenoid coil it then turns off to release the ball through the track.
Jerry