Hey, need some help locating a PDF version or possibly a hard copy of this book:
"Treatise of Physics in Elementary Presentation
by Arnold Berliner, Julius Springer, Berlin 1935
Translated by J. R. M. Radok"
I've found a site which hosts a web version, but it's in Taiwan and subject to page not found errors lately.
Apparently Radok has passed away back in 2004. CD's used to be available of this translation from German.
Anyone having a PDF version that wants to share, I would really appreciate it. I've already searched through the
Library of Congress website as well as a dozen Physics Forums. Getting frustrated. This book exists out there somewhere
on the internet. Heck, even Amazon and Google books led to dead ends.
Thanks in advance
Frog
double post, sorry
G'day frog,
Any idea what the original title of the book is in German?
That might help to locate a copy
Hans von Lieven
EDIT: Oops, I think I found it.
Lehrbuch der Physik in elementarer Darstellung,
by Arnold Berliner, published 1924
Reprints in the original German available from: http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/journal/112269212/abstract
Presumably expensive.
Thanks, as that is an earlier copy of his work in 1924, there was apparently additional work done with Julius Springer
published in 1935 with Radok translating.
This 1935 publishing copy is what I'm having trouble locating. I know it exists as it is archive in HTML on several
sites overseas, mainly Taiwan and Australia. Seems that it is a duplicate html version on several servers.
pese got me a little further in this search, thanks to both you and Hans von Lieven.
Figured out that the 5th edition was published in 1934 by Berliner, but I guess there
was a 6th edition published in 1935 with Julius Springer co-authoring and Radok translating the
book into english.
G'day frog,
I am in Sydney, Australia. Any clues where in Aussie this thing might be or under what title it might be filed?
Incidentally, Julius Springer is a publishing house, not a co-author as far as I know
Hans von Lieven
I do, I have to find my bookmark for it, give me a few ... thanks
I cannot find the bookmark for the Australian site... Radok performed
translations for another researcher on Australian discoveries after the
Dutch.
This is the one out of Bangkok, Thailand
http://mpec.sc.mahidol.ac.th/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=54 (http://mpec.sc.mahidol.ac.th/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=54)
and the other one out of Thailand
http://kr.cs.ait.ac.th/~radok/physics/ (http://kr.cs.ait.ac.th/~radok/physics/)
I'm gonna go back through my history and see if I can't locate the Australian site, but that could take awhile
it's a lot of sites I've been looking at. UGH.
Quote from: hansvonlieven on December 22, 2008, 10:30:04 PM
Incidentally, Julius Springer is a publishing house, not a co-author as far as I know
Hans von Lieven
That helps a lot. More pieces to the puzzle.
G'day Frog,
From what I can make out Radok was a translator for the Springer Verlag for many years. There are a number of scientific publications by Springer that were translated by Radok. There is a Radok that was associated with the Flinders University in Adelaide but I doubt it is the same man,
I'll have a look and see what I can come up with.
Incidentally, why is this book so important?
Hans von Lieven
Hello again,
This book contains a great deal of physics knowledge pertaining to electrical applications in hydrogen/oxygen production,
with a great deal of testing and research data included.
check out the 2 Thailand links posted above, great stuff.
Julius Springer is now Springer Publishing, http://www.springerpub.com/ (http://www.springerpub.com/) and their history http://www.springerpub.com/default.aspx?pid=57 (http://www.springerpub.com/default.aspx?pid=57)
http://mpec.sc.mahidol.ac.th/index.php?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=54
Does the link above that you posted show all of the book? I had checked all the links and had found they all work(no 404's). I downloaded all the pages to possibly make a PDF if that would make it easier to read. I have looked and found no other links to this book other than the links you posted. They seem to work for me though...
Maybe it's connection issues on my end. I know there's been cable breaks in the news, possibly affecting
servers in asia and europe, who knows I've been back several times today and still 404, maybe bad links
in the html? I also know that the html docs are without all the graphs and artwork, just hyper linked in document.
I was hoping to just get/find the entire original book or pdf, making it easier to read instead of click link
and back to document work. Makes for uneven flow when reading.
I have sent a request off to the sales dept and customer service at the publishing house, lets hope.
I know you peeps have a lot of connections outside the US, and was hoping someone may have ran across
this in their research.
Thanks a bunch, when/if I ever get back to Europe I will buy the first rounds of pints.
Well. the pages I have do show all the graphs and illustrations, so, I will try to PDF this and see how it looks. Good luck on finding the book and thanks for the pints!
UGH,
Quote
Object not found!
The requested URL was not found on this server. The link on the referring page seems to be wrong or outdated. Please inform the author of that page about the error.
If you think this is a server error, please contact the webmaster.
Error 404
kr.cs.ait.ac.th
Tue Dec 23 12:41:24 2008
Apache/2.0
http://kr.cs.ait.ac.th/~radok/physics/b13.htm#Formulation
ALL DAY LONG.
G'day Hair Bear,
If your PDF comes out right would it be possible for me to get a copy too please. I am really curious now.
Hans von Lieven
Edit:
http://kr.cs.ait.ac.th/~radok/physics/b13.htm#Formulation This link does not work, if you cut the last bit off it will, like so:
http://kr.cs.ait.ac.th/~radok/physics/
The site belongs to a Rainer Radok, I wonder if he is related to the translator, more than an even chance I think
HeairBear,
You always have the good stuff ... ;D
Yeah, I got that, but that link is from a link inside the document itself, it's supposed to be
a link to a formula which isn't shown within the document, only an external dead link. These
are what sent me off to hunt down a pdf or hardcopy of the original.
Pints for all. ;D
Try this link... http://mpec.sc.mahidol.ac.th/radok/physmath/PHYSICS/Index.htm#Physics
Frames can really mess a page up so I removed the frame bit...
This is starting to get intriguing.
If you look up the chapter on radioactivity
http://mpec.sc.mahidol.ac.th/radok/physmath/PHYSICS/k11.htm#K11
scroll down the page until you come to a picture of Otto Hahn where it says 1879 - 1968, which is correct
That would mean that the book from which this is taken was published after this date. Fascinating.
Hans von Lieven
I was thinking the same, possibly a work in progress by Radok. He passed away in 2004, but the original shows
a publication date in 1935. Or others who are hosting these documents have altered the original? Who knows?
This is why I'm seeking the original, too many cooks SPOIL the stew.
It's pages like this http://mpec.sc.mahidol.ac.th/radok/physmath/PHYSICS/k7.htm#K7 (http://mpec.sc.mahidol.ac.th/radok/physmath/PHYSICS/k7.htm#K7) that intrigue me.
Thank you frog for bringing this wonderful document/s to our attention! I can see why these people are archiving it. This is gonna be one heck of a PDF making job! OMG! what did I get myself into now?
Quote from: HeairBear on December 23, 2008, 01:57:58 AM
Thank you frog for bringing this wonderful document/s to our attention! I can see why these people are archiving it. This is gonna be one heck of a PDF making job! OMG! what did I get myself into now?
Well, you have come through in the past with some kick ass documents. I will send ya some pints for sure. Wonder what
the legal issues are with pints in the mail?
As for the document, actually kudos goes to WayToGo over on Ionizationx.com
http://www.ionizationx.com/index.php/topic,769.msg7314.html#msg7314 (http://www.ionizationx.com/index.php/topic,769.msg7314.html#msg7314)
G'day frog,
you can buy the 1924 edition for 10 Euros from Austria
http://www.antiqbook.com/boox/altes/006944.shtml
Hans von Lieven
Quote
Dear Me,
Thank you for your inquiry. I do apologize, but I am unable to
locate the product in question.
If you have any further questions, please feel free to contact
customer service at 1-800-Springer.
Sincerely,
Eugene Rotter
Springer Science & Business Media
Customer Service
-----Original Message-----
From: Me
Sent: Monday, December 22, 2008 11:17 PM
To: cs@springerpub.com
Subject: Sales/Customer Service
Hello,
I am looking for assistance in locating a hard copy or possibly a PDF
version of this book:
"Treatise of Physics in Elementary Presentation" by Arnold Berliner,
Julius Springer, Berlin 1935
Translated by J. R. M. Radok
I know this is a long shot, but I am willing and able to purchase
this book, if required.
Sincerely,
Me
It was worth a try. :(
There is a 11 year gap between published findings if I purchase the 1924 edition. The 5th edition "1934" is in German, the
6th is a translation in english "1935". and these html versions we are reading have been altered, which is verifiable by dates
of death that are after the original publishing. There were many many new findings during this time frame. Remember, there
was WAR going on the entire time.
I would like to purchase the 1924 book for comparison, might make for interesting reading, But, there are quite a few books
that cover the "history" of physics, along with some very well documented journals and letters between researchers.
What I find interesting is the fact that these editions were written for the "COMMON" man, using everyday speech during WAR.
Quote:
What I find interesting is the fact that these editions were written for the "COMMON" man, using everyday speech during WAR.
................................
Sorry frog,
There was no war in Germany between 1918 and 1939. As to your comment about the language for the common man using everyday speech, this is not unusual in German academic textbooks of a technical nature.
This was a book intended to be used in tertiary technical education (Technische Hochschule, or TH) as a textbook, as the name implies. Now, in Germany the Technische Hochschulen are quite separate institutions that are quite different in character to the standard universities. They have university status. One thing that distinguishes them from normal universities is that all students must, as part of the course, spend one full year in a trade related to the subject they study; doing a sort of accelerated apprenticeship and doing very real physical work.
For instance an architect would work as a bricklayer or carpenter, a mechanical engineer as boilermaker or fitter and turner and so forth. As a result the language spoken in the TH's is far more down to earth than in in the universities. The reasons for this are simple. Graduates of these institutions are required to give instructions to tradesmen and labourers of all kinds in their chosen profession. Convoluted academic language would not communicate to these people at all and the job would never get done.
But, I am rambling.
What I really want to say is that I think the next step is to contact Rainer Radok. Apart from the fact that I suspect he is related to the translator of the book, he is the one re-publishing the material. He has at least a copy of the book, as the photo of the cover shows and would know more about the book, its history and its several and revised editions than anyone at Springer.
It should only be one of us that contacts him, that is why I have held back so far.
What do you think?
Hans von Lieven
Hans,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_War_II
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Thirty_Years_War
Actually Germany was engaged in war during this time frame, they were in the early 30's. Germany backed Italy's invasion of Ethiopia.
Anyways, I love the info you shared about the technical manuals, "communication" is the one thing that causes many failings
with humans.
As for Rainer Radok, he/she may be an heir of JRM Radok. I sent an email to the University's department that has this hosted,
as well as Rainer's listed email address, which came back as allocated disk space over limit. The University has not responded,
possibly holiday's or Internet issues.
Quote from: frog on December 22, 2008, 05:30:33 PM
Hey, need some help locating a PDF version or possibly a hard copy of this book:
"Treatise of Physics in Elementary Presentation
by Arnold Berliner, Julius Springer, Berlin 1935
Translated by J. R. M. Radok"
I've found a site which hosts a web version, but it's in Taiwan and subject to page not found errors lately.
Apparently Radok has passed away back in 2004. CD's used to be available of this translation from German.
Anyone having a PDF version that wants to share, I would really appreciate it. I've already searched through the
Library of Congress website as well as a dozen Physics Forums. Getting frustrated. This book exists out there somewhere
on the internet. Heck, even Amazon and Google books led to dead ends.
Thanks in advance
Frog
Hello Frog
the germ book is to have at 5Euro (original used....
Gustav Pese
Tach Gustav,
Hast Du das PDF auf englisch gefunden? Wenn ja, kannst Du mir die Adresse bitte schicken?
Viele Gruesse aus Australien und ein schoenes Weihnachtsfest und einen guten Rutsch ins neue Jahr.
Gruess die Porta Nigra von mir.
Hans
G'day Frog,
I am aware of Germany's involvement in Ethiopia and in supporting Franco with the Legion Condor fighting in Spain.
This did not really put Germany onto a war footing though, since nothing changed domestically and there was no censorship at this stage. A bit like Germany's involvement in Afghanistan today.
There was, however, interference with the Julius Springer publishing house from 1935 onwards as the "aryanisation" of literature began. This, strangely enough, extended to technical and scientific literature.
Just a little tidbit to keep things interesting ;D.
Hans von Lieven
Just another tid bit of info, this also led to Berliner death as well.
Thanks for everyones help in this
Hello all,
I'm still looking for this book or a hardcopy or pdf version.
It seems that the original sites are pulling the information down off the net. Get it while you can.
Thanks
Quote from: frog on December 23, 2008, 08:11:35 PM
Hello all,
I'm still looking for this book or a hardcopy or pdf version.
It seems that the original sites are pulling the information down off the net. Get it while you can.
Thanks
I wonder if that means that someone with a lot of power out there does not want us to see something that is talked about in this book.
It is strange that there is so little tangible information available, when the book in its day was a major scientific treatise. I cannot even locate a biography on Berliner or Radok, both apparently significant scientists. (Radok, from the little I have been able to find out, was not only a translator but also a mathematician and scientist in his own right)
Keep on plugging, there is something here, I can feel it.
Hans von Lieven