These people live in the desert where the Sun is sure to shine. Do they invest in solar farms? Do they take payment from Industrialized countries that could give them thousands of square miles of solar collectors in exchange for their dead trees? Do they do anything besides sit around and barter? They don't even know how to refine crude. Their busy in religious pissing contests while they endanger their own people by their lack of foresight. Buy WMDs thats a good tactic. How much heat do these fucking people need before they stop gazing at gold and start taking care of business. Never leave to a God what you can do for yourself and your children and your brothers and sisters no matter what form they take.
Relax now sparky. We all know what they're doing is completely wrong but that's why we are helping each other on this forum. If you are American then isn't your government a bigger joke to rely on them? We all know the truth. It's not about the well being of mankind or smart choices. It's about greed and profit. They will keep people dumb and on the leash so they can milk them. This has nothing to do with religion or spiritual beliefs which they know nothing about btw or we wouldn't be on this forum. We shouldn't waste our time,effort and energy getting angry and insulting them. Their time is coming, and the more time we spend on helping each other the faster that time will come!
Peace out.
Thanks broli but I don't hate anyone or seek vengance but am sometimes astounded by not the stupidity of world leaders but the straight out IGNORANCE. They ignore everything and anything but the corporal satisfaction of the moment or become masters of compromise. Compromise means they are a Champion of nothing. Every time a champion comes to the plate for a noble cause some douche bag that is brown nosing the boss takes em out one way or the other. If you take your head out of the ass of the guy one rung up the ladder to the bottom and really look at the people pulling the strings what a bunch of IGNORANT short sighted mindless bunch of political science majors. How much science is there to chosing which numb nuts are you going to massage?
OPEC is not a people
Hi Sparks;
I agree %100 that oil is not going to last forever and We will pull our head out of our ass's and make oil obsolete.Then OPEC will have nothing but sand and heat. There political power will disappear and no one will care if they want to fight each other over how they read the Koran.I know that's a long way off but it will happen.
There are few leaders like the ones in Dubai who look to a future past oil. I hope its sooner than later because with out oil they have nothing and they will rapidly revert to the 7Th century way of life and no one will care!
And utilitarian is right OPEC is not people, it a group of families that can trace there lineage back to Mohammad and therefore get to rule all the peasants
I'm just saying that instead of dumping a bunch of oil in the US in exchange for mortgages (which I would hope Obama just says you lose fuck you) that the leadership of these states would take in exchange for their last barrels of "product"
alternative energy technology. These countries could then continue to be in the energy game and get the jump on the rest of the world for at least a generation or two. Instead these shortsighted leaders go to shindigs and flash their jewelry and figure out how to squeeze the last drop of blood out of the rest of the world. Gotta be too much inbreeding back in the caravan days when they made a living robbing people trying to trade with Asia.
Simply put the gov't can easily tax oil and gas. Right now water is a cheap sometimes free commodity. If the H2O to HHO conversion process were standardized, refined, and made to work on every vehicle and internal engine it would be too good for our country and things would collapse all around us.
The smart people with money would setup industrial whole house generators and power them with HHO, utilize the exhaust heat to run furnaces and water heaters for little to no cost.
Gov't loses the money from electrical power generation corporate and usage taxes, natural gas corporate and usage taxes, the water and CO2 emitted instead of CO1 would cause plants to grow and flourish and self repair the environment putting the EPA out of work in Washington. Gas stations would go out of business - so water usage would have to have an enormous usage tax on it to recover those losses and there would be no end to the inflation that would cause.
Cause & Effect - Cause free or alternative energies would be too good for the world and too bad for the gov't they are in Effect snuffed out by the MIB.
Quote from: sparks on January 07, 2009, 12:03:24 AM
I'm just saying that instead of dumping a bunch of oil in the US in exchange for mortgages (which I would hope Obama just says you lose fuck you) that the leadership of these states would take in exchange for their last barrels of "product"
alternative energy technology. These countries could then continue to be in the energy game and get the jump on the rest of the world for at least a generation or two. Instead these shortsighted leaders go to shindigs and flash their jewelry and figure out how to squeeze the last drop of blood out of the rest of the world. Gotta be too much inbreeding back in the caravan days when they made a living robbing people trying to trade with Asia.
Sparks, the US did the same thing when oil first hit. Texas and California were the center of the oil production universe. The US and Europe judge the Middle East unfairly when you consider that 50 years ago it was nothing but a vast wasteland with tents on the desert. Who are we to decide when their economic boom should be over? Who are we to decide their harvesting of natural resources is wrong?
Your family probably did not live in tents a few years ago. Many of these people in the middle east did.
I know many of you will say, but the ruling families in Saudi, or Kuwait, or UAE, or Oman, or the others always lived nicely so they are the evil. Well, these tribal cultures did have their rulers living well, but hasn't Europe, Asia, and the Americas? But many of the people had very poor living untile the modern times.
NOW, what I would say is we still need to remove the need for oil with new energy technology. But this racial attitude towards people just selling something they have in their dirt is uncalled for.
I'm no fan of OPEC. Its a cartel and that's not a business model that is fair or can last. It will correct itself. But lets not show racial hate towards countries which are doing exactly what many European and North American countries have done for many years.
I don't hate these people but am just trying to draw attention to their lack of foresight. They have improved vastly the quality of life for their own special people as did the US and myself included. This take care of your own philosphy is good but foresaking others including those to come for extravegent life styles of your favorite people is not. Pride is a disease that can grow and colonize just like a micro-organism. National Racial Religous pride or any act that seems to you necessary to make that puts you above the crowd is a symptom you got it. Cure it or lead a miserable life always trying to get ahead while you isolate yourself from the rest of the human experience.
Quote from: magifesq on January 07, 2009, 11:41:01 PM
Simply put the gov't can easily tax oil and gas. Right now water is a cheap sometimes free commodity. If the H2O to HHO conversion process were standardized, refined, and made to work on every vehicle and internal engine it would be too good for our country and things would collapse all around us.
The smart people with money would setup industrial whole house generators and power them with HHO, utilize the exhaust heat to run furnaces and water heaters for little to no cost.
Gov't loses the money from electrical power generation corporate and usage taxes, natural gas corporate and usage taxes, the water and CO2 emitted instead of CO1 would cause plants to grow and flourish and self repair the environment putting the EPA out of work in Washington. Gas stations would go out of business - so water usage would have to have an enormous usage tax on it to recover those losses and there would be no end to the inflation that would cause.
Cause & Effect - Cause free or alternative energies would be too good for the world and too bad for the gov't they are in Effect snuffed out by the MIB.
What are you smoking? H2O to HHO is not an overunity process. It costs more to go there than the energy that can be extracted from the resulting HHO. So you can "standardize" and "refine" it all you want, but the more HHO you make, the more money you lose.
Quote from: utilitarian on January 08, 2009, 10:40:46 AM
What are you smoking? H2O to HHO is not an overunity process. It costs more to go there than the energy that can be extracted from the resulting HHO. So you can "standardize" and "refine" it all you want, but the more HHO you make, the more money you lose.
I hear that a lot but nobody claiming it takes 'too much energy' can ever quantify how much energy it would take and how much HHO gas it would take to run a vehicle. Since this is a 'free energy board' and Stan Meyer, Bob Boyce, Daniel Dingle, and Paul Pantone have figured out various ways of using water as fuel, it may be possible for someone else to do so as well.
Hydrogen is a fuel, Oxygen is essential to the burning process, therefore its simply a matter of producing enough on demand to supply the engine.
I would think this of all boards would be a place of people with open minds.
Over unity - correct me if I'm wrong - isn't that the concept of creating a device that will produce more energy in the outcome than the energy input? Is that energy solely electrical or can other forms of energy be applied as well? It would seem that 1 atom split (usually hydrogen) produces enough energy to destroy a city, let's call it Hiroshima, its possible to unlock enough to power a vehicle.
Quote from: utilitarian on January 08, 2009, 10:40:46 AM
What are you smoking? H2O to HHO is not an overunity process. It costs more to go there than the energy that can be extracted from the resulting HHO. So you can "standardize" and "refine" it all you want, but the more HHO you make, the more money you lose.
Please put the Kool Aid down ;D and do some critical thinking ??? - how much total energy from bringing the oil out of the ground, shipping it overseas, processing it into gasoline, and then trucking it from the refinery to a gas station for me to put into my truck to burn and convert to 1 gallon of gas to 25 miles per gallon of kinetic movement does it take?
I've produced 2 gallons of HHO gas using 50 watt hours of electricity in my house @ atmospheric. I've been told that it would take about 1/2 pound of compressed hydrogen gas equivalent to propel my truck the same 25 miles. Maybe they're right, maybe they were wrong, I'll bet dimes to dollars it costs more than 50 watt hours of productive energy to produce 1 gallon of gasoline. My home electric bill was $62.53 for 727 KWH (KILO {means 1000} WATT HOURS), I paid $.086 per kilowatt hour doing the math,divide by 1000 and you get watt hour cost, divide by 1/2 and you get how much I paid to make those 2 gallons of atmospheric. BTW there's about 5500 gallons of Hydrogen in 1 gallon of water.
Now further research suggests under normal conditions the stoichiometric proportions of ideal Gasoline burn is 14:1 and produces all kinds of negative emissions when it is burned. I've read that Hydrogen as a fuel burns @ 34:1 ideally and gets about 13% more power with the end product being CO2 and water as the emissions.
Could you please answer these simple questions before going on attempting to call me out when facts are in my favor :-\ ??
Quote from: sparks on January 06, 2009, 08:06:47 PM
Thanks broli but I don't hate anyone or seek vengance but am sometimes astounded by not the stupidity of world leaders but the straight out IGNORANCE. They ignore everything and anything but the corporal satisfaction of the moment or become masters of compromise. Compromise means they are a Champion of nothing. Every time a champion comes to the plate for a noble cause some douche bag that is brown nosing the boss takes em out one way or the other. If you take your head out of the ass of the guy one rung up the ladder to the bottom and really look at the people pulling the strings what a bunch of IGNORANT short sighted mindless bunch of political science majors. How much science is there to chosing which numb nuts are you going to massage?
I am sorry sparks but you are way off here.
World leaders are neither stupid nor ignorant. They would not be where they are if they were. If that were so it would be simple to deal with.
The truth is they have a different agenda to the rest of us.And that unfortunately is the terrifying part of it. That agenda may well, and has often been in the past, your and my demise.
Perhaps there is a solution somewhere, wish I could see it.
Hans von Lieven
Quote from: hansvonlieven on January 09, 2009, 08:55:42 PM
I am sorry sparks but you are way off here.
World leaders are neither stupid nor ignorant. They would not be where they are if they were. If that were so it would be simple to deal with.
The truth is they have a different agenda to the rest of us.
And that unfortunately is the terrifying part of it. That agenda may well, and has often been in the past, your and my demise.
Perhaps there is a solution somewhere, wish I could see it.
Hans von Lieven
Unfortunately I have to agree with the people in power, technology, culture, its game over just a matter of time.
The real ugly sad part of all of this is that OPEC sheik whats his name
just stated that they have to have oil selling at $85 per barrel to "maintain"
their standards. I for one, cant see it. We can have 200 mpg cars if the
system would allow it.
Make the bed, learn to lay in it. Soon to change.
thaelin
Very shortsighted leaders unaware of globalization issues. They're still stuck in the rut my people my country my religion my my my my my over and over again. How the people under the rule of such shortsighted "owned" leaders can be duped in the same manner the population of all the preceding empires were is beyond me. Wealth is an illusion. Never trade a second of your life chasing a mirage. When you wakeup someday and find yourself in an empty palace void of any love the majicians trick becomes ever so transparent.