Hi,
Please check out the U tube movie clip I pasted below.
The fellow I believe has a excellent idea but to get it to work check out the way I have shown in my illustration. I am wide open for comments on this "half baked" idea.
The real key is to make use of a small thumbwheel mechanical ratchet as shown on the single magnet disk drive axle. The ratchet can be set to turn only one way by a single flip of a lever. Then the disk will only turn that way with ease. A lot of noise will be generated if this device works. The ratchet pawl should scream at hi speeds.
That prevents the single magnet disk from turning backwards when both disk magnets repell each other. The spiral disk is free to turn clockwise as shown and spins the ratchet disk along with it. No backturning on the ratchet disk. Whats your opinion ? -- I am sure there will be a lot.
Here is the movie clip.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evQGL5MXDwQ&NR=1
Just posted a corrected illustration showing meshed gear teeth between disks. Forget about the connecting crank arm between disks previously posted.
Hi,
this one is on my "to follow up"-playlist since last year and
i was wondering about the further progress.
Is it originally yours?
Best,
sushi
Edit: just to make clear. My question is concerning if the model and video is yours.
I did not mean the idea.
Hi,
In your diagram the rigid crank arm will not allow for counter rotation of the rotors, when the arm is in the horizontal position the distance between the arm end bearings is less than when the arm is angled. The rotors will only be able to rotate in the same direction. Cogs or a crossed belt would work, although they will give more friction.
Quote from: sushimoto on February 14, 2009, 02:07:02 PM
Hi,
this one is on my "to follow up"-playlist since last year and
i was wondering about the further progress.
Is it originally yours?
Best,
sushi
Edit: just to make clear. My question is concerning if the model and video is yours.
I did not mean the idea. Model and video are not mine.
Quote from: Yucca on February 14, 2009, 02:50:13 PM
Hi,
In your diagram the rigid crank arm will not allow for counter rotation of the rotors, when the arm is in the horizontal position the distance between the arm end bearings is less than when the arm is angled. The rotors will only be able to rotate in the same direction. Cogs or a crossed belt would work, although they will give more friction.
You are right about the rigid crank arm. Wont work. Looks like meshed matching geared teeth on the outside circumferences of both disks might work. More friction however. The magnets used would have to be powerfull enough to overcome the friction and drag of the spinning ratchet mechanism and gear teeth contact.
A long time ago I used a ratchet mechanism in one of my experiments. I operated it at hi speeds.but after a while it actually wore out. While it was working however it was a screamer..
Hi again,
As i mentioned in your other thread,
i believe that most PMM-setups should use a flywheel
to store some momentum while accellerating.
This could help getting over sticky-points and friction.
In this video of a wankel-like configuration, the
"Driver-Disk" should be much more solid and heavier...
And in general it, needs less friction at the bearings and
the transmission to the s.c. Follow-Disk..
best,
sushi
And BTW: Your drawing does not reflect the video correctly.
Quote from: sushimoto on February 14, 2009, 06:30:14 PM
Hi again,
As i mentioned in your other thread,
i believe that most PMM-setups should use a flywheel
to store some momentum while accellerating.
This could help getting over sticky-points and friction.
In this video of a wankel-like configuration, the
"Driver-Disk" should be much more solid and heavier...
And in general it, needs less friction at the bearings and
the transmission to the s.c. Follow-Disk..
best,
sushi
And BTW: Your drawing does not reflect the video correctly.
Hi You are right about the flywheel. I plan to use a heavy flywheel should I attempt to construct this device
I already pointed out the crank arm will not work as shown in my crude illustration..
Hi All,
Does anyone know where a flexible plastic ribbon type strip or roll ?? of gear teeth can be purchased?
If that gear tooth strip was wide and had self stick adhesive on the backside of the gear teeth it could be cut, wrapped, and secured around any wood disks outer circumference.
Two wood disks could be fitted with this plastic geared strip and used as temporarily as gears
Is there any known source for that and if so where can it be purchased?
Quote from: magnetman12003 on February 14, 2009, 08:14:31 PM
Hi All,
Does anyone know where a flexible plastic ribbon type strip or roll ?? of gear teeth can be purchased?
If that gear tooth strip was wide and had self stick adhesive on the backside of the gear teeth it could be cut, wrapped, and secured around any wood disks outer circumference.
Two wood disks could be fitted with this plastic geared strip and used as temporarily as gears
Is there any known source for that and if so where can it be purchased?
take it out from als frigidaires.
it sit in the closing door rubbers.
you will cut this on (knife) and you can treck out
thsis bands.
approx 10 to 4mm up to over 1meter long
i use this sienc years to hold notices on some metal-devices
g.pese
i find this NOW also (first time) to buy now.
approx 2 euros for an (i belive) an half meter long
in an sur-plus-discount.
For best results of a one way system is to use a one way bearing instead of a rachet device. check ur local hobby store for clutch bearings on rc cars. be warned the shaft must be percise, this is a link to Traxxas bearings that need a shaft of 6.125 mm. ( very affordable ) the shaft you can you can get from metric hardware and any good hardware store, good luck.
http://shop.ebay.com/items/_W0QQ_nkwZtraxxasQ20clutchQ20bearingQQ_armrsZ1QQ_fromZR40QQ_mdoZ
Quote from: magnetman12003 on February 14, 2009, 07:59:20 PM
Hi You are right about the flywheel. I plan to use a heavy flywheel should I attempt to construct this device
I already pointed out the crank arm will not work as shown in my crude illustration..
If you start replicating it, it would be a good idea,
to start progressing at the same point, where the video has ended.
... Instead of bringing in new elementary principles.
The "Follower Disk" must not make a full revolution
in order tu fulfill its purpose. It does not even need to be a full disk.
The Crankarm was just to swing the magnet out of the "sticky point".
best,
sushi
Hi Guys,
Thanks for all the input. I already rounded up gears and after some more parts right now. Looking into that one way bearing also.
I am going to give this a try as it seems by looking at the movie it might just work. I guess the magnet spiral design has to be just right also. By using a heavy flywheel and some powerfull magnets maybe I can keep the spiral moving continuously??
Tom
Hi Guys,
I purchased a couple of gears and a thought occured to me. I dont want this to be under powered so I plan to use larger powerful magnets. My problem is space. The next illustration comes to mind which is not in keeping with the spiral concept but if you look hard it works the same way using different polaritys,
I have many powerfull 1.5 inch long .75 inch diameter cylinder magnets. I have a diameter of 4 inches to work within using those magnets inside the gear teeth..
Illustrated is a plan I think might work??
The LEFT disk has zero or "NO BACK LASH" and is free to turn "ONLY" counterclockwise because a one way clutch bearing is used on its shaft. Thats the one way follower disk.
The RIGHT disk shaft is secured to a heavy flywheel. Thats the driver disk and is completely free to turn. In this case clockwise.
Remembering what is stated above can you see this turning continuously? Observe direction arrows. Teeth are meshed together on both disks. Both disks pivot in the center.
Open for opinions.
Tom
Hi,
FYI look at this magnetman.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kDvPTzJAQV0&feature=related
best regards,
sushi
http://www.magnetnerd.com/
cheers,
khabe
Besides the obvious problems of a magnet motor, in my experience you will have problems with using large neos within a cd sized space at 90 degrees, a large wheel must be used and/or use a steel round piece in the middle. I use at least 10 to 1 rule for nb 45. So if your magnet is 1 inch long, it needs to be atleast 10 inches from center of rotation, twice that would be better. Large magnets in such a close space at 90 degrees will severly brake ( slow down ) the system. Good Luck
Hi Guys,
Thanks for all your input. I am open for all good ideas and advice. I am still getting parts together to construct this device.
From what I see the less magnets used the better chances it might work. Thats in keeping it very simple like was seen in the U tube movie clip where the inventer shows a simple magnetic spiral device turning by hand pumping a single magnet in the repel mode.
Shown below is another idea but in this case two cylinder magnets are used . The force is Repel in keeping away from a magnetic lock that might occur if attraction forces are used.
I would equalize balances of each disk gear by lead weights placed on opposite sides of either magnet shown.
In addition I would have BOTH geared disks turning only "one way" using no backlash clutch bearings on both axles.
Remember the right side or "POWER" disk has a heavy flywheel secured on its axle.
The left counterclockwise or "FOLLOWER" disk is gear tooth positioned to force the "POWER" disk to turn clockwise which it easily does. Remember the "POWER" disk can only move clockwise. No counterclockwise backlash because of its shaft one way clutch. The "FOLLOWER" disk can only move counterclockwise and can not backlash clockwise.
The end result with each geared disk revolution the power disk should be repelled clockwise for an instant and then keep spinning faster and faster with each revolution ??
Analogy: Its like jumping onto a tramboline. With each jump kick you go higher and higher - but in this case the flywheel turns faster and faster with a repel force pushoff or kick given during each revolution. ????
I dont see where magnetic braking would present a problem ??
Open for comments on this HALF BAKED idea.
Tom
What makes it spin?
Quote from: brian334 on March 02, 2009, 05:43:28 PM
What makes it spin?
... and what has it to do with the "Spiral Magnet Motor"
??? ??? ???
The spiral magnet motor device was made with two magnets. One on one disk and many spiraled magnets on the other disk acting as one magnet.
The inventor hand pumped a single magnet on the simple device to get it to spin.
I am letting the flywheel power pump this device aided by a pushed pulsed repel force every revolution just like the hand pumping on the spiral device.
Granted I dont show any spiraled magnets on the power disk but the end results should be the same.
Tom.
Hi All,
Newtons third law might explain everything.
"For every ACTION there is an equal and opposite REACTION".
When two of the same type magnets repel one another one magnet heads one way and the other magnet goes the opposite way. Equally.
Now in the case of the above device if one way clutch bearings on the turning disk shafts were not present both magnets would push away from each other and nothing would move. --- I might not need a one way clutch bearing on the power disk shaft. Dont know yet.---
Looking at the power disk magnet itself we see it is repelled by the MOVING follower disk magnet . The power disk easily moves clockwise in this case and through meshed gears the follower disk magnet turns with it but in a counterclockwise direction.
Why the follower disk magnet cant move backwards is because its one way shaft bearing transmits all OPPOSITE REACTION energy to the FRAME of the device. That allows the only ACTION energy to move in the direction needed by the power disk magnet. .
I am still making and gathering parts for this and its going to be quite large when finished. If it works or does not work out I plan to post it here and on the U tube. I am having fun anyway.
Tom
Quote from: magnetman12003 on March 04, 2009, 09:36:23 PM
Hi All,
Newtons third law might explain everything.
"For every ACTION there is an equal and opposite REACTION".
When two of the same type magnets repel one another one magnet heads one way and the other magnet goes the opposite way. Equally.
Now in the case of the above device if one way clutch bearings on the turning disk shafts were not present both magnets would push away from each other and nothing would move. --- I might not need a one way clutch bearing on the power disk shaft. Dont know yet.---
Looking at the power disk magnet itself we see it is repelled by the MOVING follower disk magnet . The power disk easily moves clockwise in this case and through meshed gears the follower disk magnet turns with it but in a counterclockwise direction.
Why the follower disk magnet cant move backwards is because its one way shaft bearing transmits all OPPOSITE REACTION energy to the FRAME of the device. That allows the only ACTION energy to move in the direction needed by the power disk magnet. .
I am still making and gathering parts for this and its going to be quite large when finished. If it works or does not work out I plan to post it here and on the U tube. I am having fun anyway.
Tom
Well, this oneway bearing isn't a force. You prevent the wheel to spin the wrong direction, but that doesnt mean it will spin in the correct direction. The wheel will anyway feel the same force backwards as it does forward. So the wheel cannot start spinning because of the one way bearing. Magnetism is conservative no matter how you configure them. It should not be possible to extract energy from a device that does not contain energy.
However, I will never stop thinking on new ideas how I could get a magnet motor working, but in any simulation and calculations, I ends up in zero - every fu@#&cking time. I even get so excited I get sick from time to time when I am superconvinced that my new idea will work - untill I do some drawings and calculations. The same trip down every time. Welcome in the club Tom, but never give up ideas.
Maybe you could try to combine gravity, magnetism, buoyancy in one construction. Maybe there will be forces not known just popping out of something that appears to be nothing. A force which is able to move mass and some how use all these forces to extract the energy contained by any matter of this universe.
Remember that one single small grape, or 1g matter, contains enough energy to run 1500 - 2000 normal households with light and heat for one year -1g of matter!!!!! Sure it will be possible to extract tiny amounts of that energy from mass in a slow process. That also means that each year is 1 ton of matter required to feed every single houshold in this world with energy.
So keep inventing, and exploring.
br.
vidar
Hi Low-Q,
Thanks for your post. You are correct. I am 68 years old and have constructed so many half baked ideas I lost track counting. The day I stop thinking about this is the day Alzheimers sets in my noodle or I am dead. Some folks drink, smoke, gamble, play cards, work crosswords, for something to do. My vice is to keep thinking about and searching the outsides of the magnetic box. Hoping to grab the holy grail of overunity if it presents itself.
I have been on many emotional rolly coaster rides when I thought something might work and then it did not. Keeps me happy like a kid in an amusement park. I am climbing the hill now and now expect a drop if the device fails. I just get over it and start again. My wife thinks I am crazy but she understands. I am retired now. I had been a commercial aircraft technician for over 35 years and all this time on my own I have tried to construct a GREEN machine pollution free motor using many different ideas. My garage is full of magnet related motor projects and parts. If anyone is interested I have about 50 pounds of items to sell. Can send Jpeg photo. No magnets in that load. Have a load of broken magnets to sell seperately also. Anyone Interested?
The search goes on.
Tom
Hi Guys,
I just ran across this. Has anyone attempted to build it? Seems to good to be true. Another Hoax??
Plans and parts list are there.
http://www.greenoptimistic.com/2008/02/06/how-to-build-a-free-magnetic-energy-generator-mini-romag/
http://jnaudin.free.fr/html/mromag.htm
Tom
Hi Guys,
Here is one of my earlier experiments that used an AC powered motor with a speed control. Needed something to do one day and made this.
Its not anything overunity but has a lot in common with the whip mag setup. Its use was exactly how the whip mag setup seemed to work continuosly on the U tube. Drew a lot of attention then. The powering device was not shown by the camera then , You can see this similar power device I made here. It will power a whip mag setup at a distance. Became bored and moved on. Thought you might be interested.
Tom
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYFLB4irX94&eurl=http://www.youtube.com/my_videos_edit2
Yes, magnetic transmission is used in applications where you need a waterproof transmission between two systems. I work with those transmissions every day in pumps where a 100% seald system is required between the drive motor and the slave motor on the pump. However those transmissions are made of two ringmagnets which one surrounds the other with a very closed gap. Only a waterproof housing made of aluminum or non magnetic stainless steel is between them. The principles of operation are the same as the one on youtube you showed, except the way you have choosen to place the drive-motor and the "slave".
Well, to discuss overunity with magnets, you must find a way to cancel out the counterforce that is preventing the motors to run. That can be very hard, if not impossible, to manage. So I believe you must use other kind of forces which isn't affected by magnetism. Still it is very tricky, if not impossible, to find a way that benifits rotation. We know that magnetism and gravity is conservative, but what if we can manage to find a way to configure those forces in order to work WITH us and not AGAINST us.
I'm still dreaming of the ultimate motor, and have some ideas like the antigravity assisted buoyancy wheel I'm working on right now. I am quite exited about it, but I'll reserve some exitement untill I know for sure what I'm doing or thinking wrong about that design. Because deep inside my head I "know" it is impossible to generate energy out of nothing - at least out of nothing as we know it.
br.
Vidar