Hi all,
I got a link from a friend, where you can download the Howard Johnson
Linear track accelerator video.
It is from 1994 showing Howard Johnson
with a waggon with 2 or more ? Banana magnets going through a magnetic gate
with no repelling force and 12 pound thrusting force ( Measured via a scale)
and then being accelerated out off the gate and crusing along for a few meters.
This is a very interesting video and in the recent success of Mylow´s setup it is
very desirable that everybody should see this.
Here is the download URL:
http://rapidshare.de/files/46408889/hj01.avi.html
You must first click on FREE
and then wait about a minute for the download counter and then can click the download
button.
Then a question comes up for the 3 digit code, that you must look at and enter into the form,
where it says:
Kein Premium-User. Bitte XXX hier eingeben: and you enter this 3 digit code.
Then it will download.
It is about 15 Mbytes big and uses the DIVX Codec and MP3 audio in it.
Enoy !
Regards, Stefan.
Sound okay, interesting enough, but no image on my config. ??? Would love to see it.
"North attracting north"?
Edit : okay, missing codec, where can I find a reliable one. Does wmplugins have a solid reputation ?
Maybe someone can put it up on YT ?
Download
www.divx.com
codec.
Enjoy !
Regards, Stefan.
In a few minutes it will also be available at youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndRrCZiM1CU
In this moment it is still working to convert it, so check this out later again.
Regards, Stefan.
Danke schön, Stefan
That to me is a very non-convincing video. We never actually see the gate pull the cart in, it's always being held by HJ. When he's showing the scale that's apparently of it being pulled in, you never see that it's the cart on it's own pulling, he could be just pushing it.
And the rest of the video, he's always got his hand on the the cart until it's inside the gate, it never pulls itself in, ie it looked to me like a typical smot gate, where you get it past the sticky point by hand and then it thrusts out happily.
It actually looks in a few points that he slips as it moves towards gate and it jumps back towards him, like it takes quite a bit of force to get it in.
Andrew
Quote from: corona on March 29, 2009, 06:26:12 AM
, ie it looked to me like a typical smot gate, where you get it past the sticky point by hand and then it thrusts out happily.
Andrew, a SMOT does not have a sticky point at the entrance, cause you use a steel ball which is
always attracted into the SMOT gate.
Build yourself a SMOT then you will see it.
With Howard Johnson´s design this might be a bit different, as he uses magnets
on the runner waggon.
So it is a bit repelled,but not much, as you can see in this video but has a
pretty good velocity out of the gate.
So if he would put put a few gates after each other, the runner waggon could go on an on.
Although it would be much easier and cheaper to just use a few iron plates onto the track rail
and use only a few magnets inside the waggon to get crusing along as I have
an idea how to do this...
Regards, Stefan.
Ah yeah of course, my bad, it's been years since I built a smot and I was mixing it up with the other magnet motors I've built. But I still stand by my earlier opinions, with regard to most magnet motor designs having a sticky spot being their only undoing. That video never shows to me the lack of sticky spot, it looks rather deceptive.
I'll continue with my myloo motor replication rather than look too closely at these older HJ videos, I don't really think he got very far with his linear designs.
Andrew
In Johnson's book The secret world of magnets he shows the construction of his gate. The drawings below are from his book.
1 shows the arrangement of the 4 ceramic bar magnets magnetised through the thickness.
2 shows a circular rubber magnet also magnetised through the thickness.
3 shows the completed assembly.
Howard claims that this arrangement accounts for its asymmetric behaviour. In the video he shows three such assemblies in line.
Hope this helps
Hans von Lieven
Quote from: hansvonlieven on March 29, 2009, 07:17:25 PM
In Johnson's book The secret world of magnets he shows the construction of his gate. The drawings below are from his book.
1 shows the arrangement of the 4 ceramic bar magnets magnetised through the thickness.
2 shows a circular rubber magnet also magnetised through the thickness.
3 shows the completed assembly.
Howard claims that this arrangement accounts for its asymmetric behaviour. In the video he shows three such assemblies in line.
Hope this helps
Hans von Lieven
I made a 3d rendition of this setup to make things a bit more clear. I also believe that two opposing ring magnets can replace that pretty rare radially magnetized ring magnet.
Broli,
As far as I know the corner pieces are NOT magnets as in your drawing.
Hans von Lieven
Yeah I wasn't too sure about those. But then I saw that the outside of the ring was colored blue as well so I thought the blue indicated the south pole. Why else would he put them there. Either they are needed for the principle or they are just used to hold the 4 bar magnets together.
@ broli,
maybe there is nothing there at all in the built version or simple blocks of wood, which Howard uses a lot in some designs.
The rubber magnet is crucial, so he says elsewhere. He says that there is an interaction between magnets that changes character depending on what the magnets are made of. In some gates of his he used rubber and neo magnet sandwiches.
Hans von Lieven
I thought rubber magnet as in it being able to bend. That's the only way I can think of for Johnson making such a radially magnetized magnet. But I have a lot of knowledge in these thing and below is an attached version that uses regular axial magnetized magnets to get the same field. You have to watch out though. If you truely want the same setup as him without magnet one should use two conducting hoops with opposing currents going through them. Then you will have the same setup but that relies on current again ;D. Also do you have an illustration of the magnets on the cart? I believe I can figure out how it works if I analyze it.
Just download the book broli and you can see for yourself what he says. I'll just quote the post of mine with the link here.
Quote from: hansvonlieven on March 29, 2009, 05:47:47 PM
G'day all,
Howard Johnson published a book in 2006 entitled The secret world of magnets. It is still in print as far as I know.
However, there is a copy of it on the net in pdf form. I don't know if this breaches copyright laws, I should think so, but never mind. It is fascinating and amongst other things explains the construction and workings of his gate.
You will find it here: http://www.scribd.com/doc/34317/Spintronics-The-Secret-World-of-Magnets-2006-by-Howard-Johnson?autodown=pdf Well worth the read.
Hans von Lieven
Or you may be able to use some flexible strip magnet to make the ring one, depending on the strength required. You would also have to make sure the strip is a single pole strip and not an alternating pole strip, I'm under the impression that you can get it in both types.
Andrew
@ corona,
I think you are right. That is probably exactly what Howard did. He seems to have cut pieces out of sheets for some of his other designs.
Hans von Lieven
I believe I found a method to make such a gate with my own reasoning. All you need are two ring magnets and shielding. Maybe it'll work without shielding but in pure theory it won't. We all know that theory can be completely wrong sometimes ;D. If you have some ring magnets you should try it out. I did a basic experiment and this setup indeed pulls the magnet in and can shoot it out if it passes a sticky point. But the shielding should kill that sticky point.
@ broli,
I think Howard used his rubber ringmagnet as a sort of shielding.
Hans von Lieven
Whatever he used the design I proposed should be investigated.
Does someone have some big ring magnets laying around and maybe some iron tubing that can fit inside and acts as the shield?
@ broli,
Can you first explain just how you are going to create a magnet with one pole on both faces and the opposing pole in the centre? Are you going to force the magnets together and bond them with glue?
Hans von Lieven
Quote from: hansvonlieven on March 30, 2009, 07:45:16 PM
@ broli,
Can you first explain just how you are going to create a magnet with one pole on both faces and the opposing pole in the centre?
Hans von Lieven
Lol, those are two ring magnets faced to repel each other.
Sorry, i posted the comment before finishing it LOL You answered my question
Hans ;D
Quote from: hansvonlieven on March 30, 2009, 07:48:01 PM
Sorry, i posted the comment before finishing it LOL You answered my question
Hans ;D
Yeah I'm a fast one. And yes they have to be glued or duct taped together.
Just a note from some of my own experiments with magnets. I took 2 neos (1/2 inch dia.) and superglued them in the repelling positions just to see what happened. Guess what? The pole reversed on one of the magnets and it now became just a thicker magnet with n/s poles. I still have it sticking on my fridge and the poles are still reversed on one of the magnets....I have no idea which one but....just wanted to pass this on. If you glue two opposing magnets together you do not get 2 south or north poles. Try it and see for yourself. It is not easy, I had to use vicegrips as these neos are very strong.
Bill
Quote from: Pirate88179 on March 30, 2009, 08:11:17 PM
Just a note from some of my own experiments with magnets. I took 2 neos (1/2 inch dia.) and superglued them in the repelling positions just to see what happened. Guess what? The pole reversed on one of the magnets and it now became just a thicker magnet with n/s poles. I still have it sticking on my fridge and the poles are still reversed on one of the magnets....I have no idea which one but....just wanted to pass this on. If you glue two opposing magnets together you do not get 2 south or north poles. Try it and see for yourself. It is not easy, I had to use vicegrips as these neos are very strong.
Bill
That defies common sense as neo's need quite a large field to reverse them. I've tried both neos on neos and ferrites on ferrites and neither flip their friend's pole. If you stick a neo to a ferrite that's another story. Btw you won't find any neo's ring big enough to make a reasonable sized gate. While ferrites can be found very cheaply.
Well, with all due respect, you may say it defies common sense but that is what happens. I am looking at them now. Yes, only 1 north and 1 south pole. As I said in my post, try it yourself and you will see. If not, maybe it is possible I found the only 2 neos in the world that this will happen to but, I rather doubt that. As I said, try it and one of us will learn something. If you indeed get different results, I would be very interested in hearing about it. Thanks.
Bill
Quote from: Pirate88179 on March 30, 2009, 08:34:52 PM
Well, with all due respect, you may say it defies common sense but that is what happens. I am looking at them now. Yes, only 1 north and 1 south pole. As I said in my post, try it yourself and you will see. If not, maybe it is possible I found the only 2 neos in the world that this will happen to but, I rather doubt that. As I said, try it and one of us will learn something. If you indeed get different results, I would be very interested in hearing about it. Thanks.
Bill
Quote from: broli on March 30, 2009, 08:21:46 PM
That defies common sense as neo's need quite a large field to reverse them. I've tried both neos on neos and ferrites on ferrites and neither flip their friend's pole. If you stick a neo to a ferrite that's another story. Btw you won't find any neo's ring big enough to make a reasonable sized gate. While ferrites can be found very cheaply.
These magnets are next to me duct taped together. I don't want to start a ridiculous conversation about this so please let's drop it here.
Quote from: broli on March 30, 2009, 08:21:46 PM
Btw you won't find any neo's ring big enough to make a reasonable sized gate. While ferrites can be found very cheaply.
http://www.supermagnetman.net/product_info.php?cPath=41&products_id=420
Definitely not cheap!
Quote from: 0c on March 30, 2009, 08:39:19 PM
http://www.supermagnetman.net/product_info.php?cPath=41&products_id=420
Definitely not cheap!
Yes sorry I was wrong. I should change that to "affordable enough". ;D
Here you see a bigger sized ferrite magnet for the a fraction of that price
http://cgi.ebay.com/Large-Powerful-Ring-Ceramic-Magnet-2640g-94oz-8_W0QQitemZ330318441532QQ
So two cost 30$ while the neos would cost 850$. Also that website points it out quite nicely. This magnets are extremely dangerous and hard to handle.
Quote from: hansvonlieven on March 30, 2009, 07:45:16 PM
@ broli,
Can you first explain just how you are going to create a magnet with one pole on both faces and the opposing pole in the centre? Are you going to force the magnets together and bond them with glue?
Hans von Lieven
Greetings Hans
Here is how to do it. This can be done with ceramic magnets by placing a sized sheet of low carbon steel between like poles. They will attract to the steel and easily be maintained in that position. The soft rubber magnets as you said, will make a great inside layer IMO
Now you know how to do it. Lets get-er-done!
Quote from: broli on March 30, 2009, 07:49:16 PM
Yeah I'm a fast one. And yes they have to be glued or duct taped together.
Broli
Look at what I wrote to Hans. It is a much better way.
Quote from: broli on March 30, 2009, 08:38:14 PM
These magnets are next to me duct taped together. I don't want to start a ridiculous conversation about this so please let's drop it here.
Broli:
Normally I don't waste my time with ridiculous conversations so I understand what you mean by this. I just checked my neos again to be sure, and I was correct in telling you what they did earlier. Now, you say you have two neos duct taped together that have both south poles facing out, or both north poles facing out? If this is correct then, I only raise the question, not because I don't believe you, but I want to understand what might be happening here as I think it may be important. I believe you ok? Let's get that out of the way. Now, I used super glue and you used duct tape and we both used neos correct? If correct, the only possible difference I can imagine is that duct tape has....yes, you guessed it, rubber compound in it. (among other things) So, if the materials used to hold the same magnets together are the only difference, and I got a pole reversal and you have obtained a magnet essentially with only one pole, maybe this is the "secret" and were we should begin to look? Now, hopefully, you can see why I am raising this point again. It is for understanding and possibly some breakthrough that folks have worked on for years and yet have not been able to achieve. If you have it, folks need to know about it and replicate it and after that.....who knows? All I can say from my work here is that super glue gives you a bi-pole magnet when done.
Please share how you did this as it may be more important than you even realized while doing it. Thank you.
Bill
Alan is right, works a treat. ;D
Hans
Yes I've used electrical tape to be exact but I doubt that's the cause. And yes what Alan suggested is more piratical. I think I'm going to order two of those ferrite ring magnets as I needed them for other experiments anyway.
Just a heads up about that cage Howard Johnson uses. I am not for sure about this mind you, the gate in that video was different.
In the Howard Johnson video of his home right before he passed on, he shows the a magnet gate/track made like his late patent 5402021 working. Howard pulls a board down from from underneath the gate/track and there is some large array of magnets down there, which are NOT in the patent. Also looking at that video (which was Howard Johnson Magnet Exchange from Tom Beadons series) and the magnets under that propulsion gate, reminds me of the pictures in the Science magazine, with the glass table, and the track. Which seem to me to be those [ shaped magnets again in a slight curve.
Anyways, anyone researching Howards stuff, might want to know about that video and those underneath magnets. ;)
Also on the circlular rubber magnet for the his earlier gate, is suppose to be poles on the ID and OD of the ring. Most ring magnet you order will not be poled right. Also for that gate I suggest looking at Howards Spintronics book
http://www.scribd.com/doc/34317/Spintronics-The-Secret-World-of-Magnets-2006-by-Howard-Johnson?autodown=pdf
Cause is shows how he dampens repelling spins using the bar and rubber magnets.
I think learning about the spins is what Johnson was about really. Leedskin from coral castle suggested the same spiraling effect as well. Johnson explains it better and shows actuall evidence of work being done.
J.
By all honor to Howard Johnson and with not trying to lie to myself or people trying to replicate it: when I watch this video (have seen it before already), it is visible that the speed of the wagon gets slower and slower in the end. It makes a faster push in the so called "magnetic gate", but in fact this video proves nothing at all.
It would prove something if he would show more magnetic gates in sequence and the wagon would cross these without any problem, getting a new acceleration each time. But this is not the case. There is no real acceleration but only the first push forced by the gate only. The difficult thing is to cross this threshold a second time. Also you see the gate also has a backward push if you don't start the wagon at the correct place. To overcome this threshold you need enough force. The wagon on the end of this linear track has certainly not enough power to cross it a second time.
By my own experimentation (although not the same and no magnetic gate) I found out that it is possible with an assembly I tried from of Howards skethces with a bent magnet it crosses lots of the same or opposite poles without stopping - still it loses power in the end and eventually comes to a halt :-\
____
===> / \ ====>
S N
S N N N N N N N N N N
(first S used as starting push).