I work in a machine shop with some pretty smart guys. we are not engineers though nor are we physics majors. we do believe that the Perendev design would work if all of the bugs were worked out. we built this motor a few months ago right before i stumbled across overunity.com. we used 0.5in x 1in neodymium magnets and it does not run. we set it up in repulsion and have tried a few different combinations of magnets in the stator. through researching this device i was blown away by all of the different devices and ideas that people have come up with. if anyone has any input good or bad i am all ears.
Very nice machine job. What is the material you used, red Plexi?
Mags
Now that I think about it, this is very much the same as my setup, use the majority to push the 1 through the sticky spot. One of the problems I have encountered with this platform is the sticky spot is big. Thats why there are 3 rotor/stator sections, so that2 sections ar in push/pull mode to get through the 1 sections sticky spot. Maybe more sections. But I think we have all said that before. ;]
Does it spin smooth? Are the rotor mags even count and the stator odd?
Mags
no, it is urethane i believe. it's expensive stuff but i was able to get all of the material required out of our scrap pile. i made it so that each layer consists of 2 halves that sandwich together to squeeze the magnets in place. that way i was able to make everything laying flat on a cnc table... we thought that the material would be able to shield the magnets by itself but that was wrong. i was already almost done in the cnc by the time we recieved the magnets in the mail...
the stator and the rotor have the same number of magnet pockets...
One thing I havnt seen yet with this is the use of what Mylow would call a Permeability plate, which would be an iron ring on the outside of the mags to connect those poles together. Maybe Perendev had that inside his rotor and shell and it could not be seen, if he had a working model.
Mags
as far the spinning question: i wanted to go with bearings but we ended up going with silicone bronze bushings, the idea being that if it won't freely turn with bushings then it won't ever have the torque required to rotate a generator under load. however if you spin it by hand it will rotate easily, also the rotor probably weighs 20 pounds.
also: the bolts and all hardware are stainless.
Have you tried any timed rundowns from a set rpm to see if it runs longer in 1 direction or the other?
That will determine if the effect, as you have it, is there at all.
Mags
no we have not tried anything like that... my next step is going to be sourcing pipe or tube with a 0.5in ID so that i can make shields for the magnets. then i will need to pin the pieces to the table of the cnc using the bolt holes for location and open up all of the magnet pockets to accommodate the new OD of the new shield and magnet combo. much that i have read strongly suggests that shielding plays a major role in this motor. i intend to use mild steel with something like a 0.125in wall for a shield. do you think that the shield could be made open on the top and bottom like a tube or do you think that a shield that cups the magnet with a steel bottom is better? if i go the cupped route it will require much more screwing around than one that is open on both ends. also it would be difficult to remove a magnet from a cupped piece of steel.
Im not sure i would call it shielding. At the end of the pipe that is close to the open end is where the pole you are trying to shield will be. The iron just acts as a path to the other side, that is what magnet fields do is seek the other side. So at your opening, some of the field that you expect to be present will be attracted to the edge of the pipe for an easy path to the other side. So I cannot tell you for sure that it will help.
From what I know, Perendev used a different no. of mags on the shell as compared to the rotor so that only 1 rotor and shell mag are on top of one another and the rest are gradually out of sync.
Mags
Well 342 views so far, =] Let it brew for a bit.
Mags
Well
Ehrfinder built a drum motor using a V gate config on the drum.
he had it on his web site [which I lost in a crash]
Does anybody have that address?
Putting a "gate" that works ,onto a drum ??
Chet
BTW
Mat
Nice build !
Welcome!
well then today may be better spent exhausting all of the perendev information on this site before digging into this thing again. ive also heard of using diametrically opposed magnets in the stator which effectively attract the rotor magnet toward them and then oppose them. there are so many variables to this thing, i can see how people who work on stuff like this in their spare time can take a long time to get it all worked out. i do know that in the original patent he called for shielding...
Nice work so far. You're going down the right road. I'm glad to see that you're using magnets alone, because that's all you need to make a device like this. Now I think you should forget about shielding, it wont make any difference in the long run! If you want to get this thing to spin, you have to get past the so called sticky spot. For to do that you have to try to get your outside ring to rotate againest the inner one. This could double your usable power output and cause the inner ring to run much faster, and with speed comes power.
Quote from: matthew6060 on April 27, 2010, 03:32:33 PM
I work in a machine shop with some pretty smart guys. we are not engineers though nor are we physics majors. we do believe that the Perendev design would work if all of the bugs were worked out. we built this motor a few months ago right before i stumbled across overunity.com. we used 0.5in x 1in neodymium magnets and it does not run. we set it up in repulsion and have tried a few different combinations of magnets in the stator. through researching this device i was blown away by all of the different devices and ideas that people have come up with. if anyone has any input good or bad i am all ears.
Nice work, but I hope you know that angled magnets are not more productive than straight ones. You cannot change magnetic directivity that easy. A magnetic flux isn't a moving mass that squirts magnetic energy in one direction. Magnets are a closed loops of magnetism where pretty much nothing happens as long the magnetism in the magnet isn't changing - like in a permanent magnet. Permanent magnets contains only potential energy. No work will be carried out if this potential doesn't change. If it do, the magnetism in the magnet would rapidly degauss and be useless in seconds if the motor should work based on magnetism. But keep trying for learning at least :)
Vidar
i have read about the magnets degausing and i am not convinced that this happens. if you can point me to some convincing evidence i will be happy to read up on it. we angled the magnets because the patent called for angled magnets.
QuotePermanent magnets contains only potential energy. No work will be carried out if this potential doesn't change. If it do, the magnetism in the magnet would rapidly degauss and be useless in seconds if the motor should work based on magnetism. But keep trying for learning at least.
These statements are based on appearance and conjecture only. I challenge you, Vidar, to deguass a neodymium magnet with any method other than heat, structural or chemical decomposition, or a robust capacitor array! And suffice it to say that Neos are soon to be relegated to relative ceramic magnet status.....as new materials breakthroughs are providing dizzying results as we speak.
TS
You do know that Perendev motor never worked don't you. He was a con man. He has finally been arrested. See: http://pesn.com/2010/04/24/9501640_Michael_J_Brady_arrested_for_embezzlement/
The 'problem' with neos is that they do almost not degauss. But you need degaussing to harness the potential energy in magnets. So how can a magnetmotor work without this?
Quote from: Low-Q on April 29, 2010, 01:02:48 AM
The 'problem' with neos is that they do almost not degauss. But you need degaussing to harness the potential energy in magnets. So how can a magnetmotor work without this?
You have come up with several "good" magnetmotors designs yourself without any stickyspots.
At least on papper that is.....have you taken your time and actually built any of your devices?
Before doing this you can't deny the fact that we might find a way to build a working OU motor.
And the journey itself is a lot of fun....otherwise you wouldn't hang around here!!
I'm sure you have already come across PESN and may have read the story where it's owner, Sterling D. Allan, claimed to have contacted some guy in South America that patented a design very similar to Brady's, but long before he came on the scene. He also suspected that this was where Brady got the idea from. Anyway, point is, apart from the usual harassment, the other problem the patent holder had was degaussing magnets, which convinced him that it wasn't worth pursuing. These would have been 'old' magnet-types of course. I'm convinced that modern neo's are immune. A notion borne out somewhat by Steorn's gauss measurements before and after their week-long (maybe longer?) test which showed no weakening had taken place.
Quote from: TechStuf on April 28, 2010, 08:04:47 PM
And suffice it to say that Neos are soon to be relegated to relative ceramic magnet status.....as new materials breakthroughs are providing dizzying results as we speak.
TS
I've recently read of new alloy combination breakthroughs that could yield as high as 100mgo, theoretical on paper.
NdFeb magnets can yield 64mgo maximum. But today's commercial available NdFebs only yield 54mgo maximum.
The new ones will resist demagnezitaton even better than neos and be cheaper as they only contained 25% neodymium.
I forgot where I read about this. Can you please post a link if you have any to share?
The Domains in Neo magnets are very good...They pull each other
back up given thermal agitation...I feel they *could* be erased by
agitation that heats the micro-domains up to the Currie temperature.
This is *minus* a few defective domains. The problem is, those few
defective domains can change the sorted strength of the magnets
relative to one another. So erasure could easily change the *gradient*
in an array. This would likely follow a bathtub like (infant mortality)
curve and it normally doesn't terminate in zero field strength. So
Folks, it pays to know your gradients.
Other (old magnet) materials though *can be erased*...and this erasure
can result in apparent overunity energy when it is taking place. So
therefore "overunity in machine" claims are often followed by "magnetic
erasure" claims. Implication => use Neo, or better, magnets in your
potential overunity devices or risk wasting everyone's time.
:S:MarkSCoffman
Hi,
In looking at the design I have often wondered why the sticky spot cant be over come with electromagnets? The charging would be done at an angular offset prior to the pass point. Then when that point is passed the coils merely are charged in attraction or repulsion or chargeless. This can be done passively on the rotor. The charge coil can be placed in the rotor and the wires run to the coil at an after point.
Quote from: FatChance!!! on April 29, 2010, 03:13:59 AM
I forgot where I read about this. Can you please post a link if you have any to share?
Web link currently:
http://www.livescience.com/technology/new-generation-magnets-rare-earths-100409.html
Yes, that was the link I was thinking of. Thanks ;D
For what it's worth, here is what I would like to try.
I would position .5 x 2 inch neodymium magnets at about 30 degrees from perpendicular evenly around a rotator. Each magnet would have a Netic half-sleeve magnetic shield (from magnetic-shield.com) covering the leading half of these magnets and extending about a quarter inch beyond the magnet.
The stator would have similar magnets positioned at 30 degrees from perpendicular evenly spaced (the rotator and stator magnets would be parallel). Half sleves of Netic shields would be placed on the stator magnets to shield approaching rotator magnet fields, again extending about a quarter inch beyond the magnet.
As a magnet from the rotator approached a stator magnet, the magnetic shields of both magnets would greatly reduce the repulsive force tending to stop the rotation. As a rotator magnet reached the stator magnet the full repulsive magnetic forces would propel the rotator on.
That's what I would try. You seem much more energetic so I would like to know if you get any results.
my magnets are neodymium... giant-killer: not sure i have a complete mental picture of what you are explaining, feel free to elaborate more if you like... i was talking with a friend who showed me a video today on the "coral castle." something i'd never seen before and the builder used a wheel with magnets on it...
gobob, i like that idea. i am going to stew on that for a while... Do i need to have the same number of magnets in the rotor and the stator? or do i want one more set of magnets in the stator than are in the rotor?
Quote from: matthew6060 on April 30, 2010, 01:41:25 AM
my magnets are neodymium... giant-killer: not sure i have a complete mental picture of what you are explaining, feel free to elaborate more if you like... i was talking with a friend who showed me a video today on the "coral castle." something i'd never seen before and the builder used a wheel with magnets on it...
I believe GK has done a video himself
at Coral Castle - try searching on youtube for it. Good stuff to be seen there.
The number of magnets should not be significant.
The idea is that magnetic shielding that actually works should be used to reduce the repulsive force of rotator magnets approaching stator magnets while allowing the full repulsive forces to push the rotator on its way. This is why I suggest a "half sleeve" circling only 180 degrees of the magnet and extending a short distance from the end of the magnets.
I think we've all seen videos claiming to use magnetic shielding which turned out to be nothing more than a spacer to reduce the repulsive or attractive forces.
From what I have read, it appears that materials supplied by magnetic-shield.com actually shield or at least reduce magnetic flux.
Hi,
I know I am taking a bit chance here as most comments about Mike Brady has been quite rude and negative but here goes.......
I need some assistance from those willing to help provide information ONLY.....
.
I am not sure if you actually know my dad (Michael Brady- Perendev) or are friends with him, but I am trying to clear his name and not quite sure how to go about it. I believe he did not have a fair trial and was not given the opportunity to present evidence etc. I have not seen my dad since 2009 and would really like to do my best to get him out of where he is currently. He does not deserve this and is not guilty.
If you have any suggestions it would be greatly appreciated as well as advise how you are linked to him, maybe if you are a good friend of his you can help.
I know this is like attempting find a needle in a haystack but nevertheless I have to try.
Thank you for reading
Jackie Sasso
Daughter of Michael Brady