Hi All,
In the last few days I have researched the storage of HHO gas and as it is very dangerous
to pressurize it, there is a much easier solution to this.
To store the energy output of a solar panel for evenings and nightly usage,
when the sun no longer shines,
you can just use the right HHO and air mix in a digester setup like this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rjiDVu4adis
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1KJR2hP9nI0
This one was made for animal manure,
but if you just use a solar panel to power an HHO electrolyzer and
also power an airpump to pump air into the HHO gas in a controlled manner,
so the HHO and air mix is just set this way, so it burns slow enough like
propane gas, it could be stored very well in this rising plastic barrel drum
and this way you can store it quite nicely.
Then you can cook with it or heat your house with it
or run a generator with it to produce electricity.
This is a very green renewable cycle and you could combine it with
generating biogas this way to get more gas during the day, when the sun shines.
So biogas and HHO gas plus air could be mixed together to
be stored under these barrel drums and then be piped into the home to
get "free" gas for cooking or heating purposes..
Here is an animation,how the HHO and air gas mix can be stored:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiHDQClpZfI
The yellow barrel drum lifts up, when the gas is produced under it
and if you use up the gas the yellow barrel drum is falling down again.
If you put a weight up on the yellow drum you have always enough pressure
in the gas, so it will be pumped this way into your house.
Here is another video of a guy using this method via horse manure to
generate enough methane gas to cook in his home.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2SMQGUuY3g
But you can do it also with HHO and air mix via solar panels and have
a simular burn speed like propane.
Here is somebody on youtube, who has already done this
completely just with solar panels:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FKMseksA-H0
He seems also to store this HHO and air mix gas in
pressurized steel tanks, so it seems not to be more dangerous,
than storing propane or butane in gas tanks.
Regards, Stefan.
Thanks Stefan,
really good info as usual
Mark
Great stuff Stefan!
If someone had a large garden, or even a convenient unused swimming pool, could that be used as an ambient pressure container for the air-hho mix? I suppose a lightweight top to make the container air tight, but with large hatches that will open in case of a spark. Of course, a gate around the container for safety. Pressurized gas is nice and portable, but perhaps when you have sufficient space, it's not needed? Another idea that comes to mind : having a tower with a large air-hho bladder on top. If it blows, it blows. But no-one will be harmed. It might even work for straight-up HHO if the shockwave is aimed away from the ground well enough, and the support strong enough.
Stefan:
Some guy I read about was storing hydrogen in a hydride matrix and it was not under pressure. He said this was the answer to using this gas in motor vehicles via fuel cells. I believe it was Bob Lazar. I am not convinced of his credibility at this point however. He has had some issues.
Bill
Hi Bill,
yes you can store Hydrogen in Metallhydrid storage tanks,
but they are pretty expensive to make.
The advantage to store a HHO + air mix is that it is no more dangerous to pressurize it
and it can no longer explode. It burns just like propane gas and thus it could
easily replace all other propane and butan applications and you can store it easily
also in balloons and plastic sacks.
Have a look at all the video about
"methane digestor"
on youtube, there they also show how they store the Methane biogas.
You could even do this on your balcony, if you keep any open fire away from it,
have a look at this video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ha50GP4a00
If you use a latex balloon like Steve Harris is showing here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0xmRWw9LWFw
you can store it pretty easily and cheaply.
You only have to make sure, that nobody ignites the balloon.
If you store HHO with air as a mix in it,
I only wonder, if the hydrogen, as it is the lightest gas,
does un-mix and go to the top of the ballon,
cause it is so light weight ?
But as there is a certain pressure inside the balloon,
it could be, that the HHO-air mix is constant and does
not un-mix..
Now we only have to find a cheap, easy and safe way to put the HHO air mix
cheaply into metal gas cylinders to store more of it under
higher pressure.
Regards, Stefan.
Quote from: hartiberlin on May 23, 2010, 09:19:25 AM
I only wonder, if the hydrogen, as it is the lightest gas,
does un-mix and go to the top of the ballon,
cause it is so light weight ?
No, this isn't so. A gas will always expand to fill the volume
available for it.
Since the stochiometric mix can be advantageous, I wonder if
it could be diluted with a gas that can easily be removed, like
chlorine. a nasty solution; there will be a better one.
Quote from: Paul-R on May 23, 2010, 07:04:48 PM
No, this isn't so. A gas will always expand to fill the volume
available for it.
Since the stochiometric mix can be advantageous, I wonder if
it could be diluted with a gas that can easily be removed, like
chlorine. a nasty solution; there will be a better one.
No, this isn't going to work. We'll get HCL forming over time and
that's a bad trip. There must be another gas that will be inert,
bulk out the H and O to give safety, and be easily removeable.
Quote from: Paul-R on May 23, 2010, 07:04:48 PM
No, this isn't so. A gas will always expand to fill the volume
available for it.
Okay, that is good news.
Maybe someone can show it again, if you mix HHO with
air via an electrical Airpump directly into the Electrolyzer,
that the resulting gas mix is burning much slower.
I have already seen a video like this, but don´t find it right now.
Then it would be possible to store the HHO-air mix
inside propane or butane-gas bottles.
These Steel bottles should be oiled inside before the
HHO-air mix is pressurize into it, cause this will
make sure, that the hydrogen gas will not be so easily
diffuse through the steel metal.
This would make a great and cheap storage of the sun energy via
the HHO-air mix if you use solarpanels to generate the HHO.
If the HHO-Airmix is used up at the evening or in the next few days to cook or
to heat the home, the hydrogen has not much time to diffuse through the
steel walls of the storage bottles..
Regards, Stefan.
Just saw an article on forum linked about adding surfactant (soap) to water then HHO bubbles are nano sized and storage is easier and not explosive.
http://www.examiner.com/breakthrough-energy-in-national/ohmasa-gas-makes-water-as-fuel-more-feasible is a link to easy storage of hho, this is an answer we all been needing.