OK i'm sure they aren't but check the input/output watts on this product :
http://www.signbuyer.co.uk/ever-light-neon-power-supply-5kv-25ma-2407-p.asp
INPUT : 240*0.4 = 96W
OUTPUT : 5000*0.2 = 100W
What am i not seeing here ?
Gary.
5kv at 0.025
240 at 0.400
Here are your clues:
1:
"Constant current output
allows a wide range of tube lengths
to be operated at consistent brightness levels"
2:
"Comprehensive safety protection
unit shuts down on earth leakage
and open circuit fault conditions"
3:
"Jelly bean inhibitor
eliminates patterning in neon tubes"
4:
"Output Frequency: 24kHz"
1 & 4:
A switch-mode high frequency inverter
with a constant current output follower
that is most likely charge-pump style.
2:
Has the equivalent of a
ground fault interrupter.
3:
Sorry, sounds like hyperbolic sales bullcrap initially.
But at a very low 50/60-Hz supply frequency,
perhaps wavelength "Nodes" occur along the path...
(Correct me if wrong, always willing to learn)
Please consider this.
Only an auto-transformer style device (Car coil)
that shares ground or common base reference
works above unity when the V ratio is extreme
and is pulsed correctly to resonance.
Yeah, I'm referring to basic Tesla mentality.
Let the voltage do the work, ignore the current.
Although he was attempting to build
a mechanical equivalent of our current
microwave switching speed circuitry
with dual counter-spinning switching contacts
that are magnetically quenched into cessation.
Bless his soul.
Figure he ever achieved a 1-4 nanosecond
microwave transition level switching speed ?
He had ICE on a few coils,
I dare say YES myself ... !
However, the day I see a proper pancake coil primary,
feeding a properly tapered ubber-wound secondary,
feeding a commercial available application device.
Is the day pigs will also fly...
But Long-H and Long-C framed transformers
have been developed for many years now.
Add a modern charge pump IC,
and shared commons protection
with a GFI style protection circuit.
And instead of using the usual
primary feedback to limit current,
use the feedback instead
from a secondary output shunt
for constant-current feedback
may yield over unity...IF:
The plasma in the ionizable gas tube driven
matches a resonance drive frequency
that allows the transformer to "Float"
by sustaining the required voltage
directly from inductive collapse
while supplying the required current
to sustain the ionization required.
while remaining in resonance at all times.
Remember, they are trying desperately
to implement an equivalent technology
to sustain all currently installed lighting
with what competes with CFL bulbs...
Being able to retrofit existing infrastructure
to observe current green initiatives
dictates the release of better technology.
I have no problem believing
that lead-out energy contributes
to the efficiency as excess out.
I apologize if this got a bit heady,
but the basics are the point here.
If you have a very slow (60-CPS) source,
and your load is sustained by voltage,
be-it a Stan Meyer's cell, or an ionized gas.
The way to go is a sustained high voltage,
moderated by current limitation secondarily.
OK, admittedly, Meyers persuit required
a repetitive train of pulses to achieve
the required voltage sustaining environment
to sustain the process with minimal current.
The basics are still the same.
Make a potential difference,
limit current to sustain it.
Hope my outlook helps
someone somewhere.
Wow, Ouch, Sorry ...
I am a lousy steward of the english language,
and I spell like crap on top of that too ...
Can you belive spellcheck doesn't know
"ionization", and many other energy terms ?
To be clear, requires to many words frankly.
@Compututor
Nothing wrong with long answers what you said was interesting.
@Kooler
Sorry i put decimal point in the wrong place but the maths is correct still :
INPUT : 240*0.4 = 96W
OUTPUT : 5000*0.02 = 100W
Gary.
They are not overunity.....
The neon sign business is concerned with break down voltage of the gas in question, which relates to PEAK VOLTAGE not RMS VOLTAGE. This means that input is measured in RMS mains voltage and amperage whcih can be used for power calculations, while the output is only concerned with PEAK voltage, which CANNOT be used to make power calculations. This is most peoples misinterpretation of the neon sign business.
Thanks arma that clears it up :)
Quote from: armagdn03 on June 19, 2010, 10:11:04 AM
They are not overunity.....
The neon sign business is concerned with break down voltage of the gas in question, which relates to PEAK VOLTAGE not RMS VOLTAGE. This means that input is measured in RMS mains voltage and amperage whcih can be used for power calculations, while the output is only concerned with PEAK voltage, which CANNOT be used to make power calculations. This is most peoples misinterpretation of the neon sign business.
Yes, we could say you shed the proper light on the question. lol
I once bought two of those big heavy white cased neon transformers just because I saw the ratings. Little did I know. lol
@All:
Does that include Donald Smith.?
The newest venture is with IST trying out the florescent light ballasts. He just bought 10 of them, as he hooked up their inputs up to an AA battery, and got a surprising shock. We'll see what becomes of that, as they are a lot cheaper than the Neon sign transformer. OU, or not.
I know that it has been tried before (with the ballasts) but not by using an AA as a source. I do agree with him (IST) on keeping the input volts low as possible (AAA), while opting for and obtaining a decent output, we might live to tell about it, as those things are scary.
Hi Nick.
Yes it was reading about Don Smith that got me googling for neon trans prices. Who is IST please ?
Thanks,
Gary.
2ALL:
As to the question concerning the florescent ballasts, please check out the following video by IST (Innovation Station):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_vIF_K3QSo&feature=related
I hope that the ballast can be made to work with a Joule Thief as stated, in anycase it will be interesting to see what happens.
NZ
Wattsup,,it is possible you got the real thing ,,,a tesla coil quality NST,,,the others at 5 lbs are useless for TC work,,,if they have,then that has to be dis-abeled.Repeat,,,,this......
http://www.signbuyer.co.uk/ever-light-neon-power-supply-5kv-25ma-2407-p.asp
Will NOT work for Tesla Coil Duty.
Joe in Texas
That definitly includes Don Smith....
I was talking to Peter Lindemann on the phone a while back and the topic of Don Smith came up, there was some good laughs at his expense im afraid because he is a complete farce! His concepts are interesting however he NEVER created a device he showed that worked....and made many claims.....such as the OU neon sign transformer...which were blatantly false! You would think a person on top of their game would know such things!
@All:
If it weren't for Kapanadze's videos we could say the same about him. How many people have been able to replicate that device?
Looks to me like we have actually regresed in our technology, and that there was more going on at the turn of the century, than now.
These devices are so tricky to use, that if you were to have a working unit and take it apart and put it back together, it might not ever work again. But I feel that the working concept is important, and that we may not have hit on it, yet, or these devices would have been a reality a long time ago.
The way I see it... by now we should be living in houses that use no wires, and the breaker box activated by a device the size of a postage stamp, inserted into it what looks like a flash drive, using nano technology. Dangerous, ineficient AC current, and the grid would be a thing of the past. Why we aren't we there, yet?
I think we know why... And I also feel like someone is laughing at us. Or, am I the only one that thinks so?
Quote from: NickZ on June 20, 2010, 12:33:24 PM
@All:
If it weren't for Kapanadze's videos we could say the same about him. How many people have been able to replicate that device?
Looks to me like we have actually regresed in our technology, and that there was more going on at the turn of the century, than now.
These devices are so tricky to use, that if you were to have a working unit and take it apart and put it back together, it might not ever work again. But I feel that the working concept is important, and that we may not have hit on it, yet, or these devices would have been a reality a long time ago.
The way I see it... by now we should be living in houses that use no wires, and the breaker box activated by a device the size of a postage stamp, inserted into it what looks like a flash drive, using nano technology. Dangerous, ineficient AC current, and the grid would be a thing of the past. Why we aren't we there, yet?
I think we know why... And I also feel like someone is at us. Or, am I the only one that thinks so?
Its not about number of replicators, its about the fact that he has never shown anything working to anyone, in 20 some years, nobody has ever seen a working device. He gives out "facts" which are not, and quite wrong, such as the neon sign transformer deal, and made all sorts of crazy claims that NEVER panned out...A rose by any other name.
@ All:
Of course, you are right. But there may be more to it, than meets the eye. Just look how my posts get censored, you may not see that too.
My respects to all.
NZ