HOW TO MAKE THE SPECIAL WIRE REQUIRED FOR THE
STUBBLEFIELD COIL by MAKING YOUR OWN MACHINE
which uses COUNTER ROTATING WHEELS.
If you cannot acquire Cotton Covered Wire from rare or cost-a-lot sources, then you could still make the wire by building your own machine to do the same thing that was done over 50 years ago.
Anyway, the machine I built works up to a fashion and still needs fine tuning, but I can wind cotton over a Bare Copper wire or Iron wire or Stainless steel wire.
Before anyone asks, NO, I don't wind cotton insulated wire for others, the cost of materials and shipping would be far too much for me, hence the reason for this page describing how I made my own Cotton Insulated Wire Winding Machine.
Enjoy
electricme
This afternoon I managed to wind 6 separate cotton threads around a copper wire about 26 feet long, in a cross hatch pattern.
I achieved this by having 6 spools of cotton thread, mounting 3 spools equidistant on one rotating disk, and the other three spools on the other rotating disk in the same manner.
The disks spin in opposite directions to each other, called counter rotation, as the disks spin round, a bare copper wire is then fed through the hub or middle of these disks, the wire does not rotate, only the cotton reels.
Each cotton thread has it's own special steel eyelet which keeps the thread in the exact position required.
jim
Jim:
Well done my friend! That photo of your completed wire says it all. It looks really good. Great idea on the counter rotating reels for the cross-hatch pattern. I see this as a huge improvement over the regular winding in order to prevent some shifting of the insulation. This will prevent shorts.
If you get a chance, you should link you videos of it running over here. That was an amazing thing to see. Even though you had described it to us in great detail, I just did not "get it" until I saw it in action.
Again, very well done sir.
Bill
Thanks Bill for your kind remarks.
I agree with you about the layering, it will prevent shorts as it won't matter which way the bare wire bends, there will always be either the lower or upper layers to stop shorts occuring.
Then again, if someone went and dropped a stubblefield coil on a sharp object, then I would expect differently.
OK, I will post up here the working machine so anyone can look at it, and when they are ready to proceed they can build their own machine to make their own cotton covered wire which they can use to make their own nathan stubblefield coil.
Mine is made from metal parts, I can see no problems if anyone who was skilled in using plastic or nylon to make their machine from that, in fact it would cut the noise down quite a bit.
The drive belt is not a proper fan belt, there was so much resistance I had to use a length of clear plastic 1/4 inch hose, I joined the ends by hacksawing a 1/4 inch threaded bolt, shuved half into the end of one end, and the bit left over I shuved into the other end. It is very strong, the regilar noise id the bump of the joined ends flying around the pullies.
If you are a newbie here to OU, you may not know you can access photos or videos (tiny) from here.
Under the bottom line, you will see a green paperclip, just double click on this and it will take you to the tiny video, exch one runs for about 8-10 seconds as this is the full length my mobile phone can record video, I am planning to upgrade it soon.
The full file length alowed by Stefan is 1100kb so it won't run for to long, but as Bill mentioned above, now he understands how it works
Enjoy :D
jim
0512.3gp = This shows you the cotton winding maching, there are no cotton reels attatched, we start it up for the first time.
0516.3gp = On this one I take you on a walk, to look right around the cotton winding machine so you can see the mechanical operation.
Here I have provided 2 more tiny videos, they follow on from the last top 2 from above.
This time I have loaded the cotton winding machine with 6 rolls of white polyester cotton, each reel contains 1,000 meters or about 3,000 feet of cotton, the bobbin is marked 40/2 whatever this means, I haven't a clue.
OK, I have fed in (for this first time test) right through the center iron axle shaft, a single strand of IRON wire.
I am pulling slightly on this wire as you will see, as there is no geared motor to do this, (I need to make it) the idea is, as the bare iron wire proceeds through the center of this machine, the mounted cotton reels which are mounted on each spinning vertical disk, rotating clockwise and counter clockwise direction, will lay onto the outside of the iron wire 6 endless strands of cotton thread.
The iron wire entering the machine has a layer put down 1/8" inch before it enters the machine axle, then the other opposite layer is layed down 1/8" inch as it exits the axle.
The timing of the iron wire being drawn through the axle is critical, if I pull the iron wire too slow, the cotton tends to bunch up, if I pull the wire too fast, there are ring gaps between the cotton layers and the iron wire can be seen, so it is tricky to get a happy medium.
enjoy :D
jim
@All,
To make your own cotton winding machine there are several parts you will need.
2 identical disks (which the cotton reels are mounted on)
1 support axle, which the disks rotate on
1 support structure
1 x 12v DC or 24v DC motor, you could use a 120v or 240v ac motor but this will be more difficult to regulate in speed.
Depending on how you want to go, you could use 2 main drive motors, each motor driving each wheel separately, I chose a single drive motor as I can incorporate a PWM controller to take care of the speed of the counter rotatin pulleys, if the drive belt brakes, then both wheels stop together, this makes it far easier to rectify than if one disk is still turning laying only half the cotton on the wire.
OK I took my counter rotating pulleys from a Greenfield Rideon Garden Tractor lawn mower.
This particular mower controls its forward and reverse direction by toe/heel movement of your foot.
So if you go and visit a lawn mower place, yard, secondhand dealer, this would be a good place to start.
The rotating disks already have a machined surface where a steel ball bearing race goes, just match the axle to this part and you are almost home.
The axial can be made (if you don't by it) out of some solid steel shaft on a lathe, the ends machined down to suit the size of the inner bearing surfaces.
I simply cut the excess shaft ends off my axle which I took off the lawn mower, then drilled a 1/4" hole right through the center of this shaft, now I had the feed through hole where the wire is pulled through.
Take a beau peek at this below, you can see its a rough job, but I don't have a lathe so I used my drill press instead, the center hole is out of alignment, but it works, worts and all.
enjoy
jim
Jim:
Have you figured out a way to control the speed of the wire being wrapped as it is pulled through? I was thinking that you could rig up a hand crank to get a feel for the "correct" speed and then be able to duplicate it pretty close each time. Or just put a speed control motor on it with a VR and find the proper settings that will work.
I know you had mentioned using a pic controller or logic circuit to do this but maybe something simple might be easier?
I was just thinking is all. I am still fascinated by your creation down there and my hat is still off to you.
Bill
Hello Bill,
Thank you for asking.
At the moment I have nothing built to control the speed of the copper wire being drawn through the hub axle of the cotton winding machine.
I was thinking of using the same principle as used in a cassette tape recorder, useing the pinch roller principle, but use two seperate solid rubber wheels which can grip the cotton covered wire as it comes out of the axle, after the last cotton layers have been wound on it.
To do this, I need a PWM DC controller, sooooo, I have been out and bought a few PWM DC motor control Kits from Jaycar in Aussie, for those reading and asking are they avaliable in America? the answer is yes.
Look here www.jaycarelectronics.com or phone 1-800-784-0263
If you are in the UK try here www.jaycarelectronics.co.uk or phone 0800 032 7241
I don't usually post or recommend products, but I have delt with Jaycar before and found them excellent, if you have a different supplier, please use them.
I plan to use one of 3 gear reduction gear drives I have here made by KNIGHT of IDEX Corp.
They are made in America, powered by 24volt DC reversable motors which I bought from a second hand place in town, they came out of laundry chemical pumps, there were 2 seperate pumps in each plastic case.
Some have metal caseings others are made from PVC, but the speed of the output shaft will decide, but they have very good torque.
All I need to do is find a couple of suitable pinch rollers then marry up everything, this is why it is on hold at the moment.
Photos attatched
2965 = Pinch rollers, how I think it will look like, I have drawn only a stright through type, but the wire could be made to go around a single turn on one roller, to give some "grip" if needed, but for thicker wire, then a larger rubber roller set would be needed.
2955 = what the kit looks like
2957 = built PWM, still not tested
2961 = helpful info
2962 = a selection of geared motors I can pick from. ;D
jim
Jim:
The pinched rollers are a good idea but maybe difficult. They would need somehow to be spring loaded to be able to respond to slightly different thicknesses of wire diameter and maybe insulation thickness.
Why not use your drive controller idea on just a pick-up reel? The only problem I see here is if you are winding a long length of wire, the diameter of the winding wheel will effectively increase thereby slightly speeding up the wire traveling through the center of your winder. This could be minimized by using a wider take-up reel so the wire could be spread about a little and not just piling up upon itself.
But, don't listen to me Jim, you have done a masterful job with your design thus far and I am sure you will tackle this last feature in the same manner.
Bill
Hi Bill,
Thank you for your suggestion, I know it will work well, I had thought about using that system quite a while back, but decided not to use it because of the actual problems you mentioned.
As the layers rise on the take up spool, so the speed of the take up spool needs to be lowered to cater for this.
This is why I decided to go for the 2 small rubber wheels, which I will mount just inches from where the wire exits the counter rotating disks, it alows me to set the speed at the correct draw of the wire.
I shouldn't have any problems from bunching up of the cotton, as I do at the moment ;)
Yesterday I managed to drive a small festoon bulb using the PWM, it worked quite well, but driving a DC motor is another kettle of fish, I need to solder in a a high speed recovery diode across the motors terminals along with a capacitor to clamp the hi energy spikes which will occur while the motor is running.
If these spikes get back to the Mosfets, they will blow almost immediately
---------------------
After its all working, I need to make another drive for the take off spool, in this case it won't matter if the finished coton wire isn't layed neat and tidy, just as long as it gets wound on the spool.
I might put a couple of micro switches in series with the DC going to that motor, so if it approaches tension, the motor cuts off, then restarts as tension is too low, anyway thats a job for RON (later on).
Anyway, take a look at the photos below.
The DC Motor is a 24v motor, but I decided to try testing with 12v just to be sure it works before going to full batt voltage.
2968 = I'm testing the PWM circuit, it is powered by a 12v Gell cell, there is a 12v festoon bulb in circuit, it is running about 15% brightness, all electronic parts are cool to touch, sorry the photo is blurred.
I attatched my cro to the output, and here is the waveforms.
The bottom line represents 0 volts DC
The top line represents the 12v DC
The small top section which appears above the blank lower section represents the amount of time that 12v DC is being fed to the armature of the DC Motor
As this small top line gets wider, it tells us there is more 12v DC alowed to flow through to the motor, the wider the top line becomes, the small the lower line becomes, this is what is called the mark space ratio, or, the time between the times the power is turned ON to OFF, but it is turned ON or OFF at full grunt at each on and off cycle.
2969 = At about 15% power being delivered to the bulb
2971 = About 70% power is being delivered to the bulb
2972 = About 80% power, the top line is blury, it's an old 2nd hand scope
jim
@ All,
(Tiny 10 sec Video Below)
My 1st attempt to power up the DC Motor itself went OK which I'm quite pleased about.
However the waveform is different to what I expected, never mind.
I had a few miss giveings on the way to solder in the fast recovery diode, I had never used a diode in this manner, so I put this test off for quite a while before I had done more homework about the procedure.
Anyway, I solded on the back of the motor terminals the capacitor then the special diode, double checked it, then connected the motor wires to the PWM controller and switched it on.
The motor began to run at a slow speed, I adjusted the 5k trim pot a little and gradually took it to full output.
I felt the heatsinks on the PWM and they are cool to the touch, so Phew, I'm breathing a sigh of relief.
2975 = photo of the capacitor and the high speed diode solded to the motor contacts.
Video0554.3gp = You can see how the waveform behaves on the old BWD 511 scope
BTW, if anyone has a circuit for this model, I would be interested.
jim
Wow Cool
I was in the process of ordering Cotton covered copper on a special production run from a co. here in the states.
Found this. : :D
Ditto Bills comments as to your ingenuity Jim! I like it.
SOOOOOO now I've got a new shopping list to go to the scrap yard with and spend some time perusing the stuff near the bottom of the pile. Ha
I replicate like some design. Great fun.
I've got a couple Treadmill motors, a pore PWM and a good PWM for them.
So I will try to make the Counter rotating discs variable speed as well. they are in the 90-120V range so very powerful. Much more than needed I'm sure, but we make do. Right
I also have a ?sinkro? type table with speed and direction for winding Pancake coils but I don't think it would be powerful enough for ether application.
I think your right about the squish wheel drivers. A spring loaded pressure setter is a good Idea also there Bill. I'll be watching for what you come up with Jim.
A take-up real with slip level pressure would be good behind the drivers maybe. Whole thing dose need sympathetic shutdown as you alluded to Jim.
slightly different topic but it relates, hope you don't mind.
I got ahold of some Aluminum Gye wire. The stuff they stabilize the power poles with. It has an stainless steel core with 7 strands of aluminum warped around it all in the same direction. Must be 400' long.
I have tryed unwinding it by hand. Ha It's laying in the yard now, with about 20' undone. ???
I'm woundering if I might be able to use said same to strip it? :o
Thank You For This Thread. Oh That reminds me - Cotton Thread - Right Right Right
I'll Post my progress
FrznWtr
Just nuther thought
That shaft could be a piece of thick wall pipe. Gotta find the right size bearings for it and the Pulley wheels I get.
Teflon washer insert for leading edge?
Oh ya gotta have a couple small pulleys also. Drive belt.
Need ta make a list.
FrznWtr
@ FrozenWaterLab
Welcome to the beginnings of the Cotton Winding Machine Forum.
It's nice to have you along here developing ideas and tooling up to make your own machine.
By all means, make your own machine, but I also recommend everyone to go and buy at least 1 spool of cotton covered wire (if they can, I couldn't) so they can match it to what ever they make, it gives you a guide to follow.
That being said, there is simply nothing like the joy and feeling that one has when they have a machine that performs to their own design as you can carry out modifications to it any way you want, to improve it.
Making your own machine is frought with difficulties and you will come across them, I have, and have had to think up different ways to proceed, sometime I get held up for days or weeks.
I can say here that Bill has wonderful experience in making machines and bits of machines that if you were told about them you probably wouldn't believe it, one item is common knowledge as Bill has mentioned it in the Joule Thief thread and it has been flown by NASA, so big congrats to you Bill, who incidently is a true gentleman.
It sounds like you are a similar thinker to myself, I venture into the scrap mans domain looking for items I need.
Just remember, the principle of winding a cotton thread onto a copper wire, by feeding the wire through a hole drilled completly through a central shaft, the 2 large wheels spin on the axle in opposite directions, the 3 (or more) cotton reels spin round with each spinning wheel.
You can drive each wheel seperatly or use 1 motor, either will work.
Using mains powered motors or DC will succeed, if you want good control over speeds, then I recomend PWM drives and DC motors, or use a Stepper motor, which I know nothing about, see I'm not perfect lol.
A trick I use to unwind long lengths of wire is to anchor the far end securly.
Go the the other end and use a long light wooden pole in the verticle plane and attatch each end strand to the end of each pole, then slowly unwind the wire keeping a constant tension all the time.
Another trick I use is to anchor either wire ends to strong anchoring points, then unwind one strand at a time, rolling it up on an empty spool, this takes time but it works well.
------------------
Back to the cotton machine topic
How to prevent the drawn wire from wobbling as it has the cotton wound around it.
I noticed my drawn copper wire was wobbling sometimes violently, so I made up a special guide frame, this anchors the drawn wire and reduces this effect by 90 persent.
jim
2987 = copper wire guide frame assembly, this helps to prevent the wire being wound with cotton from wobblying all around the country side.
2988 = Close up of one of the guides, notice I made it so th ecenter guide itself can be removed and a smaller or larger guide billet can be changed. I havent got that far though.
2989 = the Wire guide frame simply slides into the vertical mounting post.
I had to do it this way so I could get access to threading the cotton thread through the eyelets.
PS, this is more complicated than any simple sewing machine, it's got a minimum of 6 cotton reels, so you can tell the little lady, my sewing machine is better than yours ha ha.
2990 = Wire guide at the feed out end, Notice the 3 small wires! at each end I turned the wire into a simple tiny as can be loop, the cotton feeds through these.
Once again welcome aboard
Enjoy
jim
@All,
I had to fly into town so most of the day was taken up with other "stuff" but I managed to put a little more into my Cotton Winding Machine, which relates with the drawing of the finished cotton wire.
2991 = Here is a back or end view mock-up of the DC geared motor and how it should be setup eventually.
2992 = Here is a side view of it.
After looking side on, I can get a bit closer to the action by shortening the length of the steel coach head bolts ends protruding from the cotton reels.
I was going to put fine springs and wingnuts on these bolts, but it seems centrifugal force is doing the same job.
jim
OK -gathering update
I found thread on E-bay
FIVE LARGE CONES WHITE COTTON THREAD QUILTING SERGER
Low bid US $19.99 FREE shipping
Five Large Cones of Cotton Thread for Machine Quilting. Each of these cones is white and has 2500 meters (2750 yds.) of long staple, 40/3 ply, mercerized 100% cotton thread. All thread is brand new, high quality and in clear shrink wrap. Compare to retail prices of over $50.00!
Also found Pair of large Industrial Delrin 8" Pulleys US $12.00 (Steal of a deal)
$11.00 US Postal
For Two - 8" across x 3" wide, groove is 1" deep. Looks like delrin "plastic" - may not be. This pully has been machined. On each side is a 1.75" bearing race.
One side appears flat so I can bolt what ever plate is required.
Didn't make it to the scrap yard (50 mi. away) But I will
Gathering square tube from my own heap for frame and the like.
Jim for the wire steadier maybe thread the holder to accept large diameter nylon bolts with a hole drilled for different size wire. worry about scratching. But then you have actual experience.
Quote:
unwind one strand at a time, rolling it up on an empty spool, this takes time
Yah I got 20' Ha-ha ;D ???
Gona try ta make a better way!
So thats just a mockup but looks like you got the concept.
I like those geared motors.
Are you thinking your wheels will give for varied clearance?
(No spring action I could discern)
Skate Board wheels might do the trick.
Lookin good Jim
FrznWtr
@ FrozenWater
Nice finding, well done.
Quote from: FrozenWaterLab on July 16, 2010, 05:55:31 PM
Jim for the wire steadier maybe thread the holder to accept large diameter nylon bolts with a hole drilled for different size wire. worry about scratching. But then you have actual experience.
Quote:
unwind one strand at a time, rolling it up on an empty spool, this takes time
Yah I got 20' Ha-ha ;D ???
Gona try ta make a better way!
Skate Board wheels might do the trick.
Lookin good Jim
FrznWtr
This is a great idea you have about threadding the holders which guide the wires, and make separate guides drilled to accept the wire sizes, only have to remember to make the internal holes sufficiently large to accept the width of the cotton as well, and a little bit bigger to allow slippage.
If a hole is too small, the wire and cotton will jamb in the hole, then the cotton winds will just pile up into a hill.
The geared motor wheels, yep, thought about this, I bought 2 hard rubber caster mount wheels at the "reject" shop yesterday, but they need to be reduced in circumference by lathe work.
The larger the outside circumference, the faster the wire will be pulled through the machine, the slower you can do this the better up to a point though.
I have already found the speed of the rotating disks alters in RPM, it is effected by temperatures and battery volts, so I need another PWM made up to control this also, I have a few kits here, so no problems about that side of things.
I also found my drive pulley needs to be changed as it is pulling too many amps under load, no problems, it will be done.
You will find you will need to transfer some of your cotton from the large reel onto a smaller bobbin, I intend to make a high speed machine to do this similar to the methods we see on sewing machines.
A Question to you FrznWtr, what should I use to open those two *.rtfd.zip files? I have tried pkunzip but it is complicated for me, oh if only makers of software could keep it simple to do things without all the bells and whistles that confuse people.
jim
Oh sorry Jim
(rtfd = Thats a tex edit file on an apple)
Nylon Bolt Guide size for, into the shaft after 1st thread layer is wound on, would need to be larger.
(Also thought an plastic pipe mounted to the thread wheel center, with 3 little holes to guide the strands would be very stable.)
Maybe mount one of those sewing machine tensioner thingees between each spool and the hole
(Uh oh I might just have made an enamy of your Misses, Jim please leave her machine alone will ya ;') :D)
But the first one before thread is wound could be just a bit larger then wire.
The third just before draw tension wheels would have to be larger still for wire and 2 layers of thread.
(Was thinking it might be better to have the drive wheels pushing on the bare wire then pulling on the threaded wire? What do you think) Maybe Both?
Take-up spool should be driven also but with minimal pressure - I would think.
? Do you intend to drive a spooler for your take-up real?
I was thinking of something already made like a deep sea rod type (Might be spendie though) then have to have narrow deep spool. Spool Synked to spooler?
Yah the speed and sinking everything is a real chalange thats why I mentioned having a PWM on the thread wheel driver. Its more control. I'm thinking if the thing can go mabey 1/4 of what it appeared to be doing in your videos I would be real happy. So what if it takes 5-6-7 Hrs to do a roll of wire. I'm on my own deadline Right ;)
Bobbin winding just like the sewing machine right. Ya I had a thought like that.
Every step brings another problem needing another solution right. Maby an attachment on an old sewing machine, Hum ::)
Ya Know yhose Cones are made for the thread to come off at the top to a ring hung over them then to ah couple turns then the feeder arm then the tensioner?
Blast, Im gona have ta take a look at my stitcher. Got a double needle double shuttle Parachute shroud shean in the basement.
FrznWtr
oops files too large
OK I've e-mailed them to myself too change them to J-peg's
Now I'll try posting agine.
By the way hears the E-bay add link for thread
It has ended but you can find more like it
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=380249716884&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT#ht_631wt_810
I was woundering if the die for the colored thread would reduce the insulating quality?
Also, might it be a good idea to use 1 or 2 on each layer of polyester or nylon?
Isent the cotton going to rot out after a year or less?
Probably need 1 in each layer to wick the moisture in.
Lets see now dosn't polyester create static? Hum maybe nylon also.
I think I need help figuring this but its something worth considering right?
FrznWtr
Looking at this DRIVE BELT TENSIONER
Or something like it.
Field trip to the auto junk yard is in order
Question is can the steel wheel be replaced with a hard rubber one?
FrznWtr
Went out to dig around in the back.
When I came back there was my UPS carbon delivery.
Wanted to share
(Think Copper is expensive)
Well to stay on topic I through I'd throw my treadmill motors and PWM's out also.
They are about 1 3/4 hp ea. Overkill I think But speed controllable.
I also placed my copper rods and arc carbon's
and a Non-magnetic stainless rod I'll use for testing.
I intend to get some aluminum also and I have 1" X 1' magnesium Rod's coming.
FrznWtr
@ FrozenWater,
You sure are keen about building your own Cotton Winding Machine for Stubblefield Coils, good to see, and I also see there are quite a number of folks in the back ground, looking at our ramblings, "welcome to you all also" ;)
Ahmmmm, you betta take a look at the date of your posted photos, it's out by a month, it's still June ;D but it's nice to see the pics of what you have there.
That's a very thick wheel, you won't have any trouble mounting your cotton reels, I'm a little concerned though, when they get up to speed, you might need disk brakes on them to slow them down in a hurry.
I think the width of them might be a problem, I relate to the distance between the 1st 3 cotton threads layed on the bare wire, to when the wire with those threads appears at the end where the 2nd cotton layer is applied.
It could be several inches between these layers, if a thread gets broken or one cotton reel comes up short during the winds, you will have a lot of unwinding to do to put it right before beginning again.
You could use a high speed motor with a soft start feature to wind from your cotton stock onto smaller reels.
Soft start meaning it starts slowly building up to speed , if it starts too quickly, the forces will snap the cotton thread.
That's a nice load of cotton reels, they look like overlocker ones.
Once again, well done.
jim
Quote from: FrozenWaterLab on July 17, 2010, 02:28:23 AM
Looking at this DRIVE BELT TENSIONER
Or something like it.
Field trip to the auto junk yard is in order
Question is can the steel wheel be replaced with a hard rubber one?
FrznWtr
An idea just popped into my head, look around for a rubber radiator water pipe that would be a snug fit over that fan belt tension-er, then you could use it with a smaller drive.
I am on the look out for a clear plastic tube which I want to glue on the drive shaft on my cable drawer motor, but will need to make a spring tension-er to put pressure on the drive shaft.
Actually, what we are making is very similar to the mechanism which drives the old cassette audio tapes which were setup in tape recorders and VHS video recorders.
jim
2905 = my cotton sizes, the biggie is 50,000 meters, about 150,000 feet, the smaller is what I am using right now for testing.
2998 = Wire eyelets I made to "guide" the cotton threads so they land correctly onto the bare wire.
Tomorrow will be a soldering day for me, time to make up another PWM Kitt to drive the counter rotating wheels, a fun fun fun day.
Hay Jim and all
Yaah I noticed the count going up on those pics also.
Blasted techy new devices. I need a 7 or 8 year old round here to properly program my camera now. >:( Sheese
Well I'm hopping my motors will have a soft start with the PWM controller.
ya know the treadmills can start very slow to begin with. I intend to use that small 3/4" drive to a large 6" or 8" to drive my maybe 4" V-belt pulley.
I figure thethread pulleys will only be 3/8" apart so tube through bearings only 6 1/2" Tube supported by welded 1/4" Plate in center. You are right but at the price I couldn't resist. Cheapest 8" pulley I could find up here was $40
Wish I was good at CAD drawing.
Now the spool cones of thread should point to the center and not spin. The centripetal force should keep the thread on the spools unless pulled off by need of wire wrap. I think Haha
Guess I'll have to try it right.
At this point I'm not lookin for speed. I want to experiment with NS coils and I like doing my own stuff. I want to wrap both aluminum and Iron wires to try them, Maybe copper also. So when I saw your thread Jim, I was with ya all the way ;D
Well I'm into the wee hours and need some rest
Hope your day goes well.
Skip @ Frozen Water Labs
@ FrozenWater
Quote from: FrozenWaterLab on July 17, 2010, 02:04:49 AM
Nylon Bolt Guide size for, into the shaft after 1st thread layer is wound on, would need to be larger.
(Also thought an plastic pipe mounted to the thread wheel center, with 3 little holes to guide the strands would be very stable.)
(Uh oh I might just have made an enamy of your Misses, Jim please leave her machine alone will ya ;') :D)
(Was thinking it might be better to have the drive wheels pushing on the bare wire then pulling on the threaded wire? What do you think) Maybe Both?
Take-up spool should be driven also but with minimal pressure - I would think.
? Do you intend to drive a spooler for your take-up real?
I was thinking of something already made like a deep sea rod type (Might be spendie though) then have to have narrow deep spool. Spool Synked to spooler?
Yah the speed and sinking everything is a real chalange thats why I mentioned having a PWM on the thread wheel driver. Its more control. I'm thinking if the thing can go mabey 1/4 of what it appeared to be doing in your videos I would be real happy. So what if it takes 5-6-7 Hrs to do a roll of wire. I'm on my own deadline Right ;)
Every step brings another problem needing another solution right. Maby an attachment on an old sewing machine, Hum ::)
FrznWtr
Short plastic pipe with the holes drilled through would be a good idea also, pity I didn't think of that.
The Misses will be OK, don't worry about upsetting her, she got no say in the matter, probably would grunt OK though lol.
If you try pushing on the bare wire and it gets cought up somehow it will bunch up and kink, when it's strightened out, it will become cristaline and weak at that point, just use the pull through method, less risks.
Friction geared drive on the takeup reel is the way to go, as the gear motor can have built in "slip" by a preassure spring adjusted via a wing nut.
Everyones machine will be different, to suit themselves, I'm not worried at all, just be sure it can do the job, fast or slow, but the operator must have control of it.
jim
Roger pull not push, got it.
Start work week tomorrow.
Later
FrznWtr
Got a chance to stop by the scrap yard on the way home from work.
they were about to close so didn't have much time but I spotted a small hydraulic disk brake. Little beat up but I can make it work if I can think where it might do some good haha Only paid a 5er for it.
My Magnesium rod came also for EB Experiments. 1" x 1'
I'm thinking 6 spools per disk with every other being fish line the same size as the cotton. Should alow wicking and long life.
FrznWtr
I would not use the fishing line. It will not allow the moisture to get through if it is wrapped any where near tight together. If you wrap with all cotton, you would not need the line anyway as far as I can see. It should be plenty strong on its own accord.
Just my 2 cents, see what Jim has to say. Nice job on finding parts for your machine.
Bill
Hi Pirate
I
m thinking about the cotton rotting away after several mounths - needing to be dug up and redone.I think the cotton will wick the moisture in no matter how tight one manages to make the windings. also I think the line willhold space for that moisture.
Have to try one with and one without.
FrznWtr
Hmm,
This is worth trying as an experiment, just to see if it will work, if it does then we would have some moden material that others could use too.
But make a stubblefield coil out of the cotton covered wire first so you have something to benchmark it against.
jim
Stubblefield said his coils could operate in the ground for years with no problems. I don't think the cotton will rot as there is no air to get to it but, an experiment is always good, then we will know.
Bill
@ all,
Just a reminder, lets keep this thread just on the Stubblefield Cotton Winding Machine and the mechanical components it will be built from.
I don't want to take away from the LocalJoe Stubblefield thread anything related to it here. ;)
jim
Got my Thread - Cats like Thread.
Weighting on my pulleys.
I have found some likely pipe for the shaft but then I need to have the pulleys so I can get the bearings etc etc
No pulley pairs at scrap dealer yet so I wait.
Got my Pullys.
I am seriously thinking of cutting them (Or one of them) in half.
I would then have a thiner setup overall like you suggested Jim.
I will run in to town tomorrow to check the availability of Bering sizes.
I'll stop by the machine shop to check cost of cutting a belt notch.
May be able to do this myself but if they can - all the better.
FrznWtr
You are doing well there FrozenWaterLab.
I'm looking forward to your results, take it slowly, saves mistakes.
I got myself a very old lathe last week, got it home and it was so heavy I had to pull it apart, (my small home made jib crane came in handy) to get it where I wanted to use it.
Unfortunatly there is no cross feed screw or gearbox, well the price was about 1/4 of a lathe with all the bits attatched.
Now I can make some special parts I will need for a stubblefield winding machine.
jim
Hay that's great Jim.
I'm seriously Jellious.
I was looking at the Tools at Alaska Industral Hardware last week.
Lets see now I could sell the truck and the house haha
Havent been to the machinest yet. But I have dug holes in the back yard for some EB Experaments. I'll be posting a blurp on NSEB in the next couple days.
I'm way behind youall Page 118 but readin as much as I can. Want to get these basic battery tests done and move up to NS Bat.
Next tuesday I'm hopping to go to the Berring Engerearing Store in Anchorage and see if I can get what I need or order them. (Outer rings are there need roller sets)
FrznWtr
Today I got back to making some more parts to add to the Cotton Winding Machine.
I needed a support bracket and central shaft to take the weight of a roll of bare copper wire. I bought a 6mm dia gal bolt from Mitre10, welded a 6 inch bolt, head to head and when the bracket was made, I welded it to the sub sliding frame.
The idea is, I undo the long bolt, remove it, put a new roll of copper wire in the bracket area, thread the long bolt through and tighten.
The weak compression springs and big mudguard washers keep the roll of wire central to the main axle feed hole.
Below is the photo of the support bracket assembly.
What is a mudguard? (ausie speak), keeps the mud from the tyres splatterring all over the shiny car, you yanks call it a "fender", but why? ;D
jim
Here is a photo of my range of cotton threads to be used on my cotton winding machine, I have a few more somewhere but have misslaid them.
So what are gentlemen doing mucking around with cotton rolls? making energy, eeeeeha.
For those who want the GIANT rolls, the label tells the tale.