PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?

[JouleSeeker]

  Thanks for bringing the discussion back to the thread topic, .99. 

  I recall having looked at this approach (without LED or diode in the output leg of the circuit) some time ago, but I'm certainly willing to take another look.  I'm in the middle of another project at the moment, but plan on some new observations early next week.

Thanks again,
Steve

[JouleSeeker]

Sorry to interject with some on-topic subject matter, but I thought it might be worthwhile seeing that the GL/SJ Joule Thief runs perfectly fine without a diode or LED in series with the load. I've made this simulation with a 100 Ohm resistive load.

I also have this running with your component tweaks, where Rload is 9.8k, Rb is 2k, V2 is 3V, and the series battery resistor (R6) is 3.1 Ohms.

Steve, I would encourage you to try this and see if:

a) it still runs,
b) it still gives you a COP>1 measurement.

Regards,
.99

@.99:  OK, I've removed the LED, as you suggested.  It rings, although there are significant changes as we shall see.  (I note that you posted your question on OUR.com also; so I'm responding both places you posted.)

Photo shows the scope traces for V across Rload -- left is with LED in, right is with LED removed.  Clearly the scope trace changes -- the frequency goes from 152.1 kHz with LED to 182.5kHz without LED, Vpp goes from 2.22 V to 4.44 V (note that the scale left is 0.5 V/div and 1 V/div on the right).  Of course, the pattern changes dramatically as one can see.

  Conditions:  Rload is 986ohms, Rb = 48.6k.  Vbatt = 1.62V.  Then I replaced the battery with a 10,000 uF cap to provide the input energy -- permitting a straightforward determination of the INPUT ENERGY (without using a DSO).  Thus, I like to use a cap for the input energy rather than a battery -- this also permits rapid comparisons when changes are made in the circuit.   (The second photo shows the circuit running off a 10,000 uF cap.  It is now a very straightforward circuit.)

For example, with the 10,000 uF cap charged initially to 1.62V, the LED glows for 46 seconds then the circuit continues to "ring" as seen on the DSO for a total of 1min 44s.  (The scope pattern, V across Rload, changes about the time the LED goes "out", but the circuit continues to ring as seen on the scope.)

Same conditions except removing the LED, the scope shows that the circuit rings for a lesser time = 51 seconds.

So, yes, the circuit changes quite dramatically without the LED, but still rings.

Now, .99, you said with this change,

Measuring Pout now becomes a lot easier.

If you will then explain how you would measure Pout with this change, I'll do it and calculate Eout/Ein. 
I'm looking forward to your suggestion for Pout; thanks.

[dimbulb]

The problem is presented, (very good way of presenting it) ... possibly one approach might be to declare the variables.
As a thought wondered if this article titled "How to measure spectrum" going down to subheading
"Resolving Power versus Spectral Coverage" Drawing attention to what is not seen on an oscilloscope but
can be represented across a range of EM spectra.
http://fuse.pha.jhu.edu/~wpb/spectroscopy/measure.html

my thinking, that regardless of how the circuit is terminated and sensed
the complete output needs to be declared.

In this software the dispersion of spectra can be adjusted. 

http://www.spectraplus.com/screenshot_DT_main.htm
A composite of these:
http://www.spectraplus.com/screenshot_spectrum.htm

Finally the software might be modified further to show a summation or combination of these. 
If presented in a meaningful way could reveal some trace of what we are missing.

[JouleSeeker]

Sorry for the lack of postings lately...  My wife and I are in Maryland helping our daughter with the arrival of a wonderful grand-daughter!  she was born last week; some complications, but both doing fine now.

I came across a very good vid, Michael Faraday, on PBS -- and it shows his homopolar motor at the end, the very first motor:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yVDHKKTC4tA

I'm doing some research on Faraday's paradox now... based on the homopolar motor / generator.

Next, a short vid showing some budding scientists -- grandchildren!   There should be a certain child-like curiosity and joy as we undertake experiments in freedom energy, IMO!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itXT8H5EXoo&feature=youtu.be

[NerzhDishual]

Hi Prof. Jones,

Thanks for the vid about Michael Faraday.

Unfortunately, this vid:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=itXT8H5EXoo&feature=youtu.be
Seems to be private.

Gwella Gourhemennou