PhysicsProf Steven E. Jones circuit shows 8x overunity ?

[jmmac]

Professor Jones, many congratulations for your grand-daughter!

I tested some of the circuits guys showed here but wasn't able to get smaller power inputs. My best is around 6uW. I'm really not sure there is any kind of OU or anomalous phenomena going on in these circuits just because there is a coil involved. Maybe the original circuit had some kind of special setup that produced an anomalous behavior but, there has been so many variations that i believe there is simply normal physics working. Electronic engineers work with coils for a century and don't see anomalous behaviors. I’ll wait with interest the measurements made with the calorimeter.

Watching all the efforts in this thread to minimize power consumption i asked myself the question of what is the minimum power required to dimly light a led, forgetting about coils, back EMF and OU. To answer this, i used a simple pulse generator with controllable frequency and pulse width (circuit 1). I used very very narrow pulses with low frequency and used a bipolar\mosfet transistor to switch the led on for the duration of the pulses. The result was very low power consumption.

Using circuit 2 or 3 (without coils) i was able to light a led, dimly and flickering with around 1uW. The pulse generator uses a battery but it doesn't contribute with energy/power to light the led. All the power to light the led comes from the discharging capacitor that is pre-charged to the desired voltage. In circuit 3, there is no current flowing through the mosfet gate. In circuit 2 there is current going through the base of the transistor but it isn't used to light the led.

Then i introduced a coil in the circuit and the led is lighted with the energy that is stored in the coil's core when current flows â€" pulse (circuit 4 and 5). The minimum power to light the led is also around 1uW.

It’s hard to compare the circuits with and without a coil since the coil generates pulses with higher voltage. Without a coil, the led brightness decreases more rapidly as the capacitor discharges, than with a coil.
Using a coil and discharging the capacitor from 2.50v to 2.00V i was able to get average input powers from 0.7 to 1.6 uW. Using a mosfet instead of a BJT did little difference. In fact it seems to decrease efficiency.

I hope this approach and info helps in some way. My feeling is that this race will achieve very efficient circuits to light leds but with no anomalous phenomena.
I propose a different contest that in my view is more interesting: Wins the one who is able to transfer the greatest percentage of energy stored in one capacitor, to a different capacitor. Several requirements can be added like the minimum energy/voltage stored in the primary capacitor.

Regards,
Jaime.

[DrStiffler]

A general aid in how to look at why many feedback (self-charging) circuit designs fail and really it makes no difference if you have a 2X or infinite gain (coherence).

One only needs to look at the transfer curves of the transistor and answer a few questions. 1) What happens when we increase Vcc? 2) With an increased Vcc does Ic increase? 3) If Vcc increases and Ic increases does that not reduce the I available to be pumped back into the battery?

If you can feedback to the battery a charging voltage and current which is high enough to flow back into the battery have we now created a current junction in which current is split between the battery and the circuit? Therefore if we could feedback via a shelf charging method one must insure that the circuit itself does not change it operational point as a result of a higher Vcc. If one uses a regulation method, the regulator will convert energy into lost heat via its normal operational mode.

There IMHO does not exist a door that can be opened that will provide infinite coherence, therefore all of the above points are very valid and the circuit must be at an operational stable point if one expects a self charging system. In short, method of regulation removing the circuit from the changes of the battery.

Now lets say we want to make heat in a load (resistor). Sounds good, but is there such a thing as cold electricity and isn't it written in the old literature that it does not produce heat? Why do LED's appear to be thermal-neutral when operating on systems such as SEC exciters? So if you want to show OU in the form of heat can it be done in a resistor or does another medium need to be present, say a gas plasma?

Just some thoughts and facts that may clear up some point for some out there.

[JouleSeeker]

Steven

congratulations to you and your family!!

welcome to the Grandpa Club! - now it's a question of patience, waiting 'til you can share the wonders of science with a developing mind and help inspire a new generation 

of course, the waiting's not hard because in the meantime you get to rediscover those same wonders watching a new life unfold

pleased to hear that they picked up on the breech in good time

6lb 12oz - that's a good weight for a future physicist, isn't it? 

Yes, that's a good start for a future physicist.    Thanks, NP and everyone.

I must say about this energy-truth community, you guys have made me feel welcomed and quite at home.  Thank you sincerely.

@Laneal -- thank you for the circuit suggestion- - I'm anxious to try it.  May have to wait for a visit today to the future physicist, though. I should note that the baby and mother are doing well -- but are located in a hospital 70 miles distant from our small town.  So it's a bit of a drive.
We got home this am at 4:30 am, so I'm also a bit tired.  But worth the effort!

@Jaime -- interesting work.  Would you do me a favor -- I routinely place a resistor R in SERIES with the LED and measure the Power input (consumption).  I find that the LED gives out close to the same light (per my eye, not too bad a measure for sameness IMO) for R values up to 69 ohms, then the LED gets dimmer.  At R = 21 ohms, I found with a Xee2 circuit that the Pinput was right around 4 microwatts uW.
   Would you check the Pinput for 21 ohms and for 69 ohms (approx is fine) for YOUR circuit?   This will provide IMO a useful comparison.
It is true that eventually (soon) we will wish to compare Pout and Pin.
   Also, I'm not so sure that your signal generator to the base of the transistor is NOT adding energy to your circuit...  my guess is that it does add energy to the system (increasing your Pinput).  Remember, we're now working at the uW level; and transistors are not perfect gating devices.

@DrStiffler -- interesting points -- yes, agreed that:

Therefore if we could feedback via a self charging method one must insure that the circuit itself does not change it operational point as a result of a higher Vcc. If one uses a regulation method, the regulator will convert energy into lost heat via its normal operational mode.

This is a valid concern, and underscores the difficulty in self-running.
Curious -- what do you think of RomeroUK's device that uses a DC-to-DC converter and which appears to be self-running?

Now lets say we want to make heat in a load (resistor). Sounds good, but is there such a thing as cold electricity and isn't it written in the old literature that it does not produce heat? Why do LED's appear to be thermal-neutral when operating on systems such as SEC exciters? So if you want to show OU in the form of heat can it be done in a resistor or does another medium need to be present, say a gas plasma?

I don't know about "cold electricity".  But for a device to be useful, there will need to be a means to extract power from the device and if used in some appliance (etc) that extracted power will produce heat.  Right? so it seems there must be some way to extract useful heat-producing power.  Are you saying that this new energy, by its nature, will not yield useful heat-producing power?

Oh -- photos of our physicist later.  The ones we took in the wee hours of the morning did not turn out too well...

[DrStiffler]

@JouleSeeker

In answer to your question about RomeroUK, I have absolutely no opinion or knowledge other than passing interest in what it was. As with everyone we have our pet ingrained opinions and beliefs and one of mine is that a mechanical device will not cohere energy and if it appears to be doing so, analysis will show that indeed the coherence is coming in at such point that it could be done without all of the mechanical fuss.

Sad we can not discuss Cold Electricity as it is the the total opposite to what one normally works with and manifests. I'm sure the over the years you will be drawn in that direction and because of its controversial nature I no longer go into it in open forum.

'Just a suggestion' You might think of making you device available in a constructed research form and the reason being the 'Grab Bag' syndrome. It would indeed provide a certified (your device) for researchers to look at and work with.

[jbignes5]

You know one thing that I have noticed in all of these systems it that there is a conversion to a higher voltage potential of a high current storage device. This conversion based on the magnitude of the transformer gets to a point where very little is lost in the transfer but they get an extreme potential raise that can be transformed yet again to net a gain in current.
What that point is has yet to be established but I think Tesla was onto something with his "magnifying transformer" that he used to simulate static discharges of the Wimshurst machines. With statics we all know surface area is the most important aspect and I believe it is the same with this technology.

You are going in the right direction looking for the lowest input because if you could get it to that point it would start to pull in tremendous potentials from the surrounding area.

I had great luck in using a device that the good Doctor was researching a while back. We coined the phrase "Captret" and it seemed to connect with the source without pulling to much current. Although I don't believe this is the correct method to tap the source. Something in the capacitive end of the spectrum is like a filter. It keeps the flow of current very low and allows the potential to swing wildly or effortlessly enhancing the force by giving it momentum with very little input. Think of it as a biased modulator, with the bias being the cap voltage level. The swing comes from the capacitors ability to pass ac at that point enhancing the swing of the ac signal, in effect giving it more punch.

I'm starting research on ways to have this separation of load to the source. This will have to be done through caps hooked up in such a way that there is no direct link to the load. Each side of the battery will have polarized caps on it and a third cap to act as a swing tank. Three caps hooked to the source. Like I said I'm starting research in this area so nothing was done yet just some ideas from what I have been seeing in all these peoples experiments.