PLEASE READ THIS-MAJOR BREAK THRU FROM BILL MEHESS

[JouleSeeker]

Hi Stefan
1. At this point I am still determining if this is a galvanic reaction. I need to continue to remove all the
components that would create a galvanic reaction. Actually a galvanic reaction is not that bad if that what it turns out to be as long as I can limit or eliminate the component degregation-wll have to see on this one. Is it sucking moisture from the water or air-that to be determined.
[snip]

Bill, this is Dr. Jones.  Please note that if this is indeed a galvanic reaction, you cannot "eliminate the component degredation", since the galvanic process DEPENDS on a chemical reaction which necessitates degrading at least one of the reacting materials. 

A chemical process is inherently limited -- it cannot go on forever, and it is not overunity (by any reasonable definition). 

You may have a very nice battery and with that thought I wish you the best.
Steve

[billmehess]

Bill, this is Dr. Jones.  Please note that if this is indeed a galvanic reaction, you cannot "eliminate the component degradation", since the galvanic process DEPENDS on a chemical reaction which necessitates degrading at least one of the reacting materials. 

A chemical process is inherently limited -- it cannot go on forever, and it is not overunity (by any reasonable definition). 

You may have a very nice battery and with that thought I wish you the best.
Steve

I believe that logic would dictate that you are correct, I will keep working on it as I am also working on two other devices along a parallel line. As always the journey will be traveled and the goal won  with persistence.
Bill

[hartiberlin]

Hi Bill,
thanks for the additional infos.

You should try other contact materials other than clip leads.

Just try instead of clip leads -> pencil leads ( graphite) and/or silver wire.

What will these read for voltages and what is the short circuit current on your
digital meter ?

Many thanks.

Regards, Stefan.
P.S: If you have different pickup cables between your digital voltmeter,
like your soldered connection cable, be cautious, this could also
produce error effects.
So just use for instance 2 copper cables from the digital voltmeter
and wrap them without any solder onto 2 graphite pencil leads
and touch with them your plate and don´t put the pencil leads into the water.
Will be interesting to see, what voltage and shortcircuit current this will generate.

Also change the position the pencil leads will point to on your plate and
tell us, if a distance of 5 mm will have the same voltage and current
as a distance of 100 mm.

Many thanks.

[NickZ]

   I thought I would add that Lasersaber has made cells that although are entirely galvanic in nature, he has been controlling the oxidation factor by submerging the whole cell into a bath of motor oil.  He is seeing no oxidation with this method. This may indicated that the galvanic reaction is not the cause of the oxidation factor, that ruins the cells in time, but instead it may actually be just moisture and oxygen that are the causing the deterioration and breaking down of the metals.
  To entirely eliminate galvanics (two different metals cell) may also cost the loss of valuable current and voltage levels,  in order to obtain the wanted non galvanic cells. 
   A galvanic cell works by a charging and discharging process, which functions at the expense of the metals, which may not have to be the exact same situation here. As there is no additional charging in this case,  but a continual one way output instead. 
To prove the point is not an easy matter, but that is what many of the current non-galvanic crystal cell builders are now working towards.
  As the saying goes...  Time will Tell...
                                                           NickZ

[triffid]

test