quentron.com

[sarkeizen]

@sarkeizen i repeat. this thread is about the commercial viability of the aforementioned quenco.

You can "repeat" all you want.  I have already given pretty sufficient grounds as to why I've been talking about what I've been talking about.

In my experience among humans when someone is talking about 2LOT because they were asked: "Hey did you know 2LOT has been broken for 60 years?" we do not require further justification to be involved in the discussion.  It's self-evident as part of the social contract.  Perhaps in your town or, more likely cell-block people jump up and say "You're not allowed to talk about that".   If such positions existed outside of the despotic state where you grew up.  I assure you that they have been largely retired or shived as the case required.

you still havent answered as to why you bother about trivialities e.g. 2lot?

You're right.  I haven't answered a question that was not directly asked and a fallacious "complex question" no less.   Funny that.  If you are asking why am I talking about 2LOT for a small portion of this thread.  It's exactly what I said before.  Much of Philips writing about quenco includes the claim that if violates 2LOT - demonstrating that this is not the case is germane to his claim - even Philip seems to think so as he made the posting in a board marked for just such conversations.   More recently Lumen implied that 2LOT had been broken by Bella Legosi's Pile** discussing 2LOT in this context is of course understandable.   If you have a question about another place where I mention 2LOT then you should cite it and I'll tell you why I was talking about it at the time.

**still too lazy.

Since I'm apparently supposed to guess the question you are going to ask and answer it.  You may consider it germane that I also have no strong views on penguins intermarrying with elephants.  I believe in love in all its forms.

and im beginning to think that this quirky obsession of yours is highly suspect.perhaps to purposely steer attention away from the issue at hand

That might be an argument if you had a strong way of establishing the "issue at hand" to the exclusion of a number of related issues.  You don't.   So it isn't.  Congratulations, you're wrong.

regarding my aforementioned referal to the subsection of textbooks,if you dont have the electrochemistry knowledge to see the connection

Score one for me I guess?  It's not as easy as you seemed to imply.  Your argument has taken a predictable turn towards inconsistency.  We were all about looking at textbooks - in particular looking at something you claim is clearly laid out in all sorts of textbooks.

I say: "Sure, ok lets look at textbooks, show me where" and now you are mute on the subject.  Not a word about which part of which well known textbook.  Not a peep.  Nothing.  I've given in to your despotic demand to no longer talk about 2LOT (except where I am defending my prior conversations about 2LOT and if you have a problem with that you've graduated from idiot to troll).  I've even given in to your despotic demand to focus on textbooks.   The only tiny request I made is that you show me *WHERE* I can find this information in a mainstream text.  Where are the ten rules of battery making (or 13 or 127 whatever) clearly laid out.

And your answer is: "..."

of no help or use in our quest for commercialy viable solutions to our energy needs..

Sadly, when I logged on to this forum I didn't check the box that said: "Profitis gets to tell me what to do".   Is that despotic demand No. 3?

[profitis]

@sarkeizen if i sell you a quenco to use to power your calculator at an affordable price with a money-back guarantee that it wont run flat in the next 30years are you going to now start shooting me down over 2lot trivialities? I gues in your case yes,which is a pity because if you had taken the trouble to go to your electrochemist friend and asked him to refer to the mentioned textbook subsection and build an oxygen electrode concentration cell for you you might have been given one for free.

[sarkeizen]

@sarkeizen if i sell you a quenco to use to power your calculator at an affordable price with a money-back guarantee that it wont run flat in the next 30years are you going to now start shooting me down over 2lot trivialities?

This a deceptive characterization.  The places where I have spoken about 2LOT are where it was being discussed - in fact my original argument against Philips device wasn't directly a 2LOT argument.  It was simply that Philip seemed to argue that he had a Maxwell's Demon device that would produce work forever in an isothermal environment.  I argued that information theory says "no" and when he simply decided that those rules don't apply to him I argued that complexity theory also says "no" by what I think of as a novel use ov BBBV.   When you pitched a whiny fit about me talking about 2LOT - I switched and talked about textbooks (at your despotic request).  Apparently that isn't good enough for you either because you sure don't seem to be delivering on your end of the bargain.

Again to further your integration back into human society,  normal humans do not need further justification to discuss 2LOT.  Being on a board about 2LOT violations is enough, being asked a question (even when *gasp* you are NOT on a board about 2LOT) is enough.  We do not all live in the police state that is (apparently) in your head.

Anyways...

So should I now infer that you have backed away from the argument isn't that there is something in a textbook somewhere that says you can power something forever in an isothermal environment?  That seemed to be what you were saying before.  Now you're saying the textbook only can tell me how to build a battery that will last 30 years in a mild duty-cycle in a non-isothermal environment?

Well...um...so?  We already have things that do that.  I been to sites with 23 year old solar panels and I've definitely heard of 30 year old panels.  While the cells used in calculators 20-25 years ago were lower quality than the ones I'm talking about it seems plausible that a 20 year old calculator would work today.  So you're going to have to qualify your argument more...eventually we will see it's weakness and I will pounce like a puma.

if you had taken the trouble to go to your electrochemist friend

I don't have such a friend.

...and you kept saying "look at the textbooks" and "powered forever" and you still can't give me a cite.   Considering I've given in to all of your despotic demands that's a little unfair don't you think?

[profitis]

@sarkeizen hey if your friend,s skills are good enough he,l build you an ipod or radio battery that,l go on for 30years.dont go thinking that an oxygen electrode concentration cell is piddlywinks.they can pack a powerpunch baby,ive seen it.ok lets chat about 2lot since your not going to stop bugging me about it yes its a maxwell demon.no temperature difference required between the two electrodes in any particular direction.an oxygen concentration cell is the electrochemical equivalent of quenco.find a friend to build one for you and chek it out.

[sarkeizen]

@sarkeizen hey if your friend,s skills are good enough he,l build you an ipod or radio battery that,l go on for 30years.

Is this your argument?  Do you have an argument anymore or have I already crushed them?

What about your argument that there is something in a textbook which validates....ok....whatever your argument is now?   Am I supposed to take your avoiding the question as evidence that you no longer think textbooks say anything about this?  Why are you trying so hard to avoid talking about the argument you wanted to discuss so very badly just a day ago?!

ok lets chat about 2lot since your not going to stop bugging me about it

What?  Have you read anything I've typed?  Other than defending against your constant infantile whining about my prior mentioning of 2LOT.  I've said: "Hey let's talk about what you want to talk about...textbooks"...and now you are trying to pretend that I'm bugging *YOU* ROFL.  If I'm bugging you about anything it would be that you actually get on with your argument about textbooks.  I'm ready to read some textbooks,  so again please provide the magic passage that I'm supposed to read.

yes its a maxwell demon.no temperature difference required between the two electrodes in any particular direction.an oxygen concentration cell is the electrochemical equivalent of quenco.

But quenco is a quantum device right?  If it's a maxwell's demon device it is effectively sorting.  Therefore it's sorting at O(1).  However BBBV says it can't do any better than O(sqrt(N)).

find a friend to build one for you and chek it out.

I don't need to.  You've kind of agreed that quenco can't work or at least is very unlikely to.