How to install and tie together magnet wire coils

[aidrenegade]

First, apologies to forum admin if I've posted my first post in the wrong section, please move it and let me know. I've just performed a 'search' for this coil question but didn't see anything relevant. I should point out I'm a DIY home enthusiast with some general service engineer background but none in this specific field.

I'm in the process of making a possible overunity device based on a mini magnetically levitated vertical axis system to remove as much friction as possible out of the equation. I've made 10 coils 15mm wide with 370 turns of .71mm magnet /coil wire. They are to be installed vertically so they pass between 12 pairs of 30mm X 30mm X 10mm 34kg pull magnets with 27mm between the faces of each pair. The magnets all alternate in polarity between each pair as I'm from the UK and aiming for a 240v AC output.

At present I'm not sure how to tie the coils together in series. I'm thinking the first thing to do will be to tie coils at 180 degrees to each other then tie the 5 pairs of coils together to create my output. To make each pair how do tie them? EG - inner coil wire to outer coil wire, inner to inner or outer to outer. Due to the relativly small thickness of the wire I was thinking that tieing them in pairs first would be more efficient for power output.

Next I was thinking I should tie the pairs together in series to create my output. I'm worried that due to my very limited experience with coils I'm 'missing something' and I can in fact only join each coil in series singularly and making pairs first won't matter. Any available youtube videos would be helpful!

Thankyou in advance for helping out this 'newbie'. I joined this forum because I need a little help. I will of course share my results with the forum one I finish my build.

[aidrenegade]

First, thanks to those who looked at my post. Attached are some pictures so you can see what I'm trying to build. I already know joining the coils in series, inner wire to outer wire, does not work as the voltage is half of what a single coil can produce for the same rpm. I've put connectors on all the coil tails so I can experiment easier. First I'm in the process of upgrading the the fan moter to a 120w version. I was suprised how much drag the flux put on the system, 550rpm max with 1 coil down to 270rpm with all 10 coils fitted using the old 35w fan motor in the pictures.

Also heres some pictures on flickrhttp://www.flickr.com/photos/92089676@N05/with/8544595306/#photo_8544595306

[Dave45]

check the wind turbines, how they are tied together

[gyulasun]

Hello aidrenegade,

You have got an interesting coil-magnet arrangement for sure. IF you do not have a dual channel scope to see the phase and amplitude relationships of the induced voltages between any two coils, then the best advice would be to rectify the output AC voltages of each of the coils and use a single puffer capacitor to collect them all into a common DC output. (RomeroUK used this method in his Muller motor/generator setup on this Forum).
Theoritically the amplitude and phase outputs ought to be identical in the coils which are just induced by the same pole magnet pairs (i.e. in every second coil if you have alternating magnet pairs) but due to the mechanical differences and differences in magnet strengths there are voltage and phase differences between the coils, this may make the outputs a bit lossy to sum.

Of course when normal diode bridges are used with 4 diodes in each, the power loss increases at the output because the forward voltage drop in a diode bridge doubles versus the half wave rectification (always two diodes conduct during any half wave) so perhaps using 2 diode full wave rectifiers instead of the 4 diode bridges can reduce diode losses to half. Here is a link to see a full wave rectifier with 2 diodes only and notice that it is also a voltage doubler so the DC output is twice the peak AC voltage coming from your coil: http://www.tubecad.com/january2000/img46.gif from this page: http://www.tubecad.com/january2000/page14.html  So each coil of yours would have two diodes as shown in the gif image for one (secondary transformer) coil and the 2 capacitors would be the common summing point for all the 10 diode pairs, ok? (yes the two series caps would have all the 10 series diode pairs in parallel as is shown for the single diode pair in the picture and the center point between the capacitors (+ and -) would receive the 10 coil endings say A1, B1, C1 etc. as a big common joining point and the center point of any one individual diode pair (Cathode-Anode) would receive A2, B2, C2 separately for each diode pair of course. The summed DC output for all the 10 coils this way would be as shown as the output at the upper capacitor positive and the lower capacitor negative points.
So each coil output is efectively paralleled as a doubled DC voltage across the two capacitors.

You may not like to get DC output from your generator but this 2 diode full wave rectification method to effectively parallel the voltages from all your output coils seems the simplest solution to see the total power output your setup is capable of and makes it easier to compare to your input power. (DC output power is much easier to measure than AC output power.)

You wrote that the 10 coils when fitted caused drag (a loss) in rpm from 550 rpm (when only a single coils was fitted) to 270 rpm, driven by the 35W old fan motor. I guess this was simply caused by the total mass of the 10 coils versus the single coil mass and not by any eddy current drag caused by the closeness of inner aluminum plates to the center circled magnets used for the levitation? (as is shown in your above picture)

Did you use super glue to fix the magnets onto the Alu plates? Maybe this fixing solution is safe for the some hundred high rpm but in case your 120W prime mover motor would have rpms in the thousand rpm range then the magnets may fly away just because the nickel coating may get teared down by the rotational forces. I have seen such coating simply pealing away from the rest of the magnet material beneath it when a glued hard disk magnet was attempted to be taken off its shielding plate. IF your would-be motor has rpm over 1000 it is advisable to tape the magnets around their backing Alu plates too, to be on the safe side.

I am curious to know the output voltage amplitudes you tried to connect in series, of course it is rpm dependent too.  If originally you wished to get 240V AC and planned for 10 coils then you may have expected 24V AC output from a single coil? I can see 12 magnet pairs for the 10 coils, if this is so, it makes any AC summing connections difficult because there will always be coils covered only partially by magnet pairs in any moment anywhere and this goes around cyclically.
One more question: within a magnet pair the facing poles are always unlike poles, say NS, and the next magnet pair coming just after the previous one has also unlike facing poles but with SN, right?

Greetings,  Gyula

[aidrenegade]

Thanks for the replies. I've since found this online:
http://www.stanford.edu/~hydrobay/lookat/pmg.html#sect-6-b
I've set up my coils as shown in the diagram for a sinle phase motor, I went inner wire to inner wire, outer to outer etc in series. @gyulasun, it was in this info I first realised I might have problems using 12 pairs of magnets but only 10 coils but I'll try the setup I have first. It will take a few days but I'll post my next results. I'm just after the 240v ac first and the rpm required to generate it. Also good point about the magnets covering giving way at speed, I'm hoping about 750 - 850 rpm should do it though. With no scope I'll have no idea of the hertz though I have a knackered old laptop I can try in addition to light bulbs or power tools. Yes the poles are NS SN NS etc.