How to install and tie together magnet wire coils

[aidrenegade]

More Thoughts....

Just a few minutes after posting the rpm started dropping (and so the dc output). I've already asked for a possible replacement idea for the dimmer switch.
Iwas also wondering if the 4uf / 400VAC capacitor that is attached to the motor may be causing problems. I know virtually nothing about motors and have no idea what this capacitors job is. There was no capacitor fitted to the first fan motor I started experimenting with.
Can I just cut out this capacitor and tie it's 2 leads together?

Although the fan motor doesn't get too hot to touch I appreciate that the fan blades it was driving also helped keep it cool. Could this be a problem in the motor when used in my build?

I'm currenty feeding the 3 speed fan motor through the live wire that that gave it it's highest speed setting. Would it be worth trying to feed it through the midde or lowest speed live wire? Afterall, I'm only looking for about 340 - 350 rpm. Could this be why I'm having so much trouble controlling the motors speed?

30 minutes later....

Tested this last thought! With the lowest speed wire the rpm kept increasing when the dimmer switch was turned down to it's lowest.
Middle speed wire had same problem....
Tried using a 250w rated dimmer switch and this made the problem worse. Hmmm... Maybe a higher wattage dimmer switch may solve the problem, time to get searching online....

[gyulasun]

Hi,

Probably you did it correctly but I editied your picture to show the diodes connection. So you make a single diode with the indicated common anodes ( cathodes are connected inside the case), and one such connected MBR3045 will be used as a single diode, and should be connected as the voltage doubler schematic indicates them, ok? It means that for any one coil you need to use two such MBR3045 diodes, each prepared with the piece of wire as shown, ok?

Re on your dimmer control, normally such dimmers do not really designed for motor control but for incandescent lamps i.e. inductive loads like your motor may ruin it or influence its operation.  If you can obtain a dimmer for higher power than the present one you may try it but I cannot tell whether it would be good on the long run.  A much better slution but more expensive is to get a Variac, a variable rotary autotransformer (NOTICE it does not give a galvanic isolation from the mains!!!)
See here what I mean: http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_trksid=p5197.m570.l1311.R2.TR3.TRC0&_nkw=variac+variable+transformer&_sacat=0&_from=R40

Here is a 700W+  (240V/3A) type: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Variable-Transformer-3A-240V-Open-Type-Variac-3-Amp-/290807447062?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item43b5797e16  and will serve you for long, for other purposes too.  With such variac, any AC voltage coming from the 240V AC mains  can be set and the AC current maximum is specified for each variac you have to pick for your motor needs.

IF you do not load with anything your 12V DC output (with car lamps or whatever) then the charge is stored in the capacitors for a long time so a small change in rpm on the fan motor will not be noticed,  But across a load which takes the charge from the caps you will see small rpm changes too. 

The 12V DC input range for an inverter is normally specified in its user manual or data sheet, if you do not have such, try to look for it on the web, you may have luck to find it. In most of the cases the input range is governed by the normal lower discharged state of the 12V batterys, maybe this is at 11.7 or so and the upper limit may be 14V or so.

Re on your 4uF capacitor on the fan motor,  you should not deal with it, it belongs to the fan motor, once you found on it, it needs it, it is probably the so called 'run' capacitor for the AC motor, google the web what a run or runner capacitor is for a single phase motor.

Your fan motor can get warm or hot when you load your generator with useful load and it makes the fan motor as the prime mover 'sweat'...  and yes the original blades may have helped it cool. So you have to watch for the temperature of your fan motor during the tests.

I still think that from Lenz drag point of view you would be better off when you have an odd - even pair of coils and magnets...  now that you rebuilt the setup to have equal number of coils to that of the magnets this die is cast... ?

rgds, Gyula

[aidrenegade]

IF you do not load with anything your 12V DC output (with car lamps or whatever) then the charge is stored in the capacitors for a long time so a small change in rpm on the fan motor will not be noticed,  But across a load which takes the charge from the caps you will see small rpm changes too. 

I still think that from Lenz drag point of view you would be better off when you have an odd - even pair of coils and magnets...  now that you rebuilt the setup to have equal number of coils to that of the magnets this die is cast... ?

rgds, Gyula

All my rectifiers are now built and connected to coils then connected in parallel. Not got a variac yet but still experimenting. No load gives 12v dc @ 342 rpm. Putting on load is a different matter. Just a 12v dc 21w bulb puts on enough drag to slow rpm to about 228 & a output voltage of 4.2v dc. Even with the dimmer turned on to full 240v supply my 120w motor can't turn any faster.

RE: Lenz drag which I've definately got, I can't fit any more magnets to the inner ring due to the brackets I'm now using but I will make some more brackets and see if I can squeeze more magnets in around the outside ring.

[aidrenegade]

4 Extra magnets around the outer ring made only a slight improvement but I could'nt balance out the magnet assy to get it to run smoother. Next I reverted back to the 10 pairs of magnets only but also back to a N/S, S/N, N/S etc etc arrangement. On the plus side I now only need about 240rpm to generate 12v dc. On the minus side the Lenz drag might be even worse.

If I can get hold of an old 12v car battery I'll see If I can use my device to charge it, a bit like a wind turbine would I'm hoping. Any ideas on what the result will be? Will drawing load from the battery still cause Lenz drag on my device? Any other thoughts anyone?

[gyulasun]

Hi aidrenegade,

In your setup the Lenz effect is inherently 'included', unfortunately. What I wrote so far as suggestions were aimed at reducing any possible loss which also inherent in the usual circuits.
Your attempt to charge a car battery will also involve Lenz drag, albeit the charge current taken from your coils may be less then a direct bulb load across the output so you may experience less drag, depending on the charging current value taken.

If you wish to see motor or generator setups that allegedly has a low Lenz drag, I can direct you to some videos on that but due to lack of information from the author so far, no real measurements have been revealed. For a no Lenz no back emf motor setup watch this video: http://www.general-files.com/go/147592130300 and also another one here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4TICXxP1jI4

On generators, you can find so called low Lenz setups on this youtube channel (no real performance measurements have been shown though):
http://www.youtube.com/user/TechnikerX/videos  start with the lower left video, it was the first).

Another video series on this low Lenz generator setup is here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9aXPeOHV0B8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tupA4Y-wqw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mUilkDpvsiI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wja4TIeW_d8

If you ask me on these setups I think that the first two videos may indeed show pulse motors with very good efficiency while the videos on the generators may or may not show low Lenz drag, only correct tests can give answers .

Finally, here is a patent application on a pulse motor from Paul Babcock where you can also see permanent magnets as rotors embracing cylindrical stator coils in a ring: http://www.faqs.org/patents/app/20110156522 


rgds,  Gyula