Self accelerating reed switch magnet spinner.

[synchro1]

@Conradelektro,


Here's another video from Igor that I posted earlier on this thread. He runs a magnet attached to a ferrite rod into the empty core of a trifilar Bedini coil. Power, trigger and output. The pole of the core magnet is opposed to the poles of his six magnet rotor. You can clearly see him demonstrate the magic of increased output, decreased input coupled with rotor acceleration. Your test motor is a weak piece of crap! That's why you're getting opposite results! Take a closer look again at Igor's one and a half inch neodymium sphere reed switch rotor above.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mzNjAs3-9LA

[synchro1]

A simple platform to fairly retest the radial magnet stack coil core, would consist of a bifilar reed switch aircore coil, with a large bearingless neo sphere spinner, one coil for output the other for power. One could run the radial stack into the empty bifilar coil core and test for increased output and rotor speed. This is a very simple setup and would generate a thousand times the torque and flux field of Conradelekto's "Mickey Mouse" setup! Conradelektro's darning needle point would grow red hot and melt if he tried to achieve the rotational speeds of the bearingless neo sphere spinner! Piece of crap!


Everyone can see Igor get the effect with a monopole rotor and axial magnet core. It's not too far to go to imagine the effect's similar with a diametric rotor and radial magnet core! Conradelektro is just acting like some kind of child! He's supposed to be stripping wire off the coil and running the magnet stack in and out of the core. I only had one layer of wire on my original! He's really acting lame. Conradelektro's proving the magnet slows the rotor down! He can't even accomplish the simple speed up Ibpointless2 achieves with his plastic lid rotor! This guy is completely incompetent, and all his results so far are bogus. He could have played Gene Hackman's role in the Hoosiers!

@Conradelektro,


Why not power a large neodymium sphere up with a reed switch in series with the bifilar coil you wraped, like in Igor's schematic with a diode and capacitor. Divide the wraps, one for power the other output, then try ruuning the radial magnet core stack into the bore hole and try and measure the rotor speed and output?


Here's a video on magnetic vortex. The last few seconds are particularly informative:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YrR03K4nfY8

[conradelektro]

@MileHigh: thanks for your comments, it helps me to understand better what I am trying to do.

Your posts are coming through almost a day late, so I did the "Maggie type coil test" before seeing your comment about Lidmotor's Maggie "Satellite Coil". And my test seems to confirm the better "impedance matching" when inserting a spinning ball magnet in the air core (which is at a large distance from the rotor).

What I am trying to do:

- At the beginning of a coil test I let the rotor speed up to about 2000 rpm by supplying 13 Volt to the drive circuit. From former measurements I know that the drive circuit consumes about 25 mW (about 2 mA at 13 Volt). I let the rotor spin for a minute to settle the rpm at around 2000 rpm.

- Then I move the "pick up coil under test" to such a distance to the rotor that the rpm drops to around 1200 rpm (the shunt resistor is connected). This needs some doing and patience, but eventually I find just the right distance and the rpm settles to around 1200 rpm (20 Hz to 23 Hz).

- The measurement with the scope is then done over the shunt parallel to the coil, the shunt resistor matches the DC resistance of the "pick up coil under test" (the impedance match error is kept within 10%). The scope probe is AC coupled. (The scope shows "true RMS".)

This "measurement protocol" is designed to always have about the same conditions during all tests. Which allows to roughly compare the "output capability" of each "pick up coil under test".

So far I tested:

- my "synchro coil replication" with air core, magnet stack core and spinning ball magnet core

- a coil from a 24 V relay (the same as I use as drive coil and trigger coil) with air core and iron core

The results (under the above measurement protocol) are all in the same order of magnitude, which is around 300µW to 600µW output from the "pick up coil under test".

I guess that one has to allow at least for a measurement error of 50% or even 100%, but the order of magnitude of the output measurement should be correct and seems to be consistent.


I will move on to pan cake coils.

MileHigh, do you have any suggestions for the geometry of the pan cake coil (I will try a monofilar and a bifilar)?

- Should the pan cake coil have a large diameter? (Its thickness will be the diameter of the wire.)

- I guess that the largest practical coil diameter for my test set up is about 100 mm, because the rotor is about 50 mm above the "floor"? (But I could move the spinning magnet higher up, the axis is very long.)

- Should I use thicker or thinner wire for the pan cake coils?

My argument:

A magic coil should at least show an output of several mW under my "measurement protocol". (Because the "non magic coils" show consistently an output of less than 1 mW.) OU would happen at an output of more than 25 mW (because I need 25 mW to drive the rotor).

Of course one could spin a bigger magnet very fast, but that would need several Watt and make all measurements just more complicated and less transparent. I also refuse to be near a magnet spinning at 24000 rpm.

I know that I am not showing anything new, but it should shed light on claims being made in this thread. An experiment (however simple) has more weight than mere words (however forcefully put forward).

Greetings, Conrad

[MileHigh]

Synchro1:

You need to calm down and just go with the flow.  In the first Igor clip you linked to, there is no BEMF looping back to the source.  The BEMF discharges though the diode.  In the second Igor clip you can see the current consumption increase on the power supply when he showed increased output when he inserts the rod into the coil.   In all three clips nothing special is happening but you have to make proper measurements to understand what is going on.  The clip that you linked to about the alleged magnetic vortex is pure bunk.  There is no Bloch wall at the center of a standard bar magnet like they allege in the clip.  All of the magnetic domains inside a bar magnet are lined up so the bar magnet looks like a single large uniform magnetic domain.  Seriously, that clip is pure junk and I know that unfortunately many people have this mistaken belief.

Conrad:

You made a comment about your measurement error.  It is probably more like less than 1%.  It could be way less than that.  The RMS voltage calculation on the scope is averaging out thousands of samples, and that makes the measurement more accurate.  I suggest you check the specifications for your scope for the measurement error.

So far your tests are great.  The one thing that I don't like is the pulse motor to drive the spinning magnet rotor.  It's weak and it slows down and you have little control over it.

Something for your consideration that would cost very little and might even be fun:  Do you have another variable power supply?   If you go into an electronics hobbyist/surplus store they usually have beautiful DC motors of all shapes and sizes.  If you could find a nice decent-sized 12-volt motor (10 cm x 10 cm or perhaps a bit smaller?) that could be used as the drive motor for your spinning magnet rotor.  It might only cost the equivalent of five dollars US.  Then you could connect a variable power supply to it.

The idea is simple:  Test the various coils at different distances and keep the rotor RPM constant.  That way you can do better comparative tests.  Also, with a larger motor running at a higher RPM, you could measure much more output power from the various pick-up coils.

If you have a lot of power being burned off in the pick-up coil load resistor that may slow the DC motor down a bit from the increased Lenz drag.  That's where the variable power supply comes in where you can slightly increase the voltage to the DC drive motor to compensate.

With respect to your test results, everything looks pretty much like you would expect it to look.  And that's a good thing.  Note the relay coil has a larger outer diameter than the other coil setup (I think) and that could explain the higher power output.  Note I mentioned that the geometry of the coil is of prime importance.

Note the whole idea of comparing power in to the pulse motor and power out from the pick-up coil is not relevant at this point.  The input power is much much greater than the output power.  Hence the suggestion to replace the weak pulse motor with a cheap surplus DC motor.

MileHigh

[synchro1]

@Conradelektro,


Look, it's very unfair of you just to walk off from that "Synchro Coil" experiment after sabotaging the test with way too many windings and all the time I put into explaining how it works. You're just out to make a fool of me and I have a right to be angry with you! The induction from those excessive wraps is generating a locking field and killing the the magnetic oscillation.


Here's what I want you to do: Remove the magnets from the bobbin, then wrap a layer of plastic dielectric tape around them. Then wrap one bifilar layer, connect the near and far end in series, attach the resistors, then play the coil back into the flutter zone you discovered and check the output! The thin layer will reduce the inductance input to practically zero, so anything you get should be from the oscillation alone. This should not have a slowing effect on the rotor. You didn't test that coil, you just failed to get it to work! I feel you owe me and the thread audience at least that much.