Sharing ideas on how to make a more efficent motor using Flyback (MODERATED)

[wattsup]

Hi wattsup,
just to let you know, the MOT primaries are and have always been connected in parallel. I have never tried connecting them in series and was not planing to. I want minimal coil resistance for maximum flyback power.
Thanks
Luc

@gotoluc

Great, but is the pulsed side going to the inside start of the winds nearest the core? Sorry to ask so many questions that I could not figure out with the vids. If it is, then just consider trying the added third MOT primary in series between the always connected side of those two primaries. But again, 10 volts in those coils is like playing ping ping in a Wallmarts.

I understand the "minimal coil resistance" but I think 10 volts on that wire is way to low to see some of the better effects that should only be starting to scintillate. Like exactly the flyback. Adding the third MOT will increase the flyback and increase how far the now 10v pulse goes into the two primaries. 

So where and how does the "bucking" come in?

Always a pleasure to see your works man.

@woopy that goes for you as well. Sorry if I did not respond to anything about your build here because I am always afraid that the topic is now advancing further along and would not want to cause a topical regression. But I can if you want, hehehe

wattsup

[digitalindustry]

Yes digitalindustry, TinMan and I know of Jim Murray.

I don't usually follow or replicate the work of others and mostly if they keep things secret.

There is still more to come from this topic and my motor design. There will be a new build that I'll be able to do high rpm tests coming out soon. This will allow to verify if the input power changes under different loads. If that build is successful then there will be a large 2hp version built next.

So, at this time I'm not looking for more ideas but more time to do the work.

Regards

Luc

ahh i see thank you

indeed time is a valuable resource always appearing so anyhow.

great work i'll watch in future and hope to contribute maybe, 'in time'

[gotoluc]

Great, but is the pulsed side going to the inside start of the winds nearest the core?

Not sure what you mean by "the pulse side"...  the way I have both MOT primaries connected is, the positive is connected to the beginning of the windings nearest to the core. Both MOT's are a mirror of each other. I'm sure it could be connected the other way around but I doubt it would make a difference. The important thing is for the magnetic fields to be repulsing each other and that it is.

Sorry to ask so many questions that I could not figure out with the vids. If it is, then just consider trying the added third MOT primary in series between the always connected side of those two primaries. But again, 10 volts in those coils is like playing ping ping in a Wallmarts.

Again, not sure what you mean by always connected side? Both primaries are always connected in parallel.
What would the series coil in between the two MOT's do?... would it be an air coil or a fully closed MOT?
Anything over 10vdc will cause the present (proof of concept) I core rotor to rub on the E-cores.
I'm presently building another prototype that should be able to handle more power and RPM.

I understand the "minimal coil resistance" but I think 10 volts on that wire is way to low to see some of the better effects that should only be starting to scintillate.

I agree but it already shows it to be a promising design idea.

So where and how does the "bucking" come in?

Point two identical speakers, coils or magnets and the will be neutral point no matter the strength of the magnetic field or sound level. Obviously it gets more interesting as the strength goes up but it's all the same effect.
Back in 2009 Gyula had suggested to me to consider building a all repelling motor using two identical transformers. I considered it but after this test: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAYsAN5QPnA  I thought it may not have much torque so I never built it.
But using my most recent idea of a I core rotor in between the bucking transformers it turns it back to attraction force as long as you don't over saturate the I core rotor. It's kind of brilliant if I may say so ... also, there is an increase in inductance (double) from the time the power is turned on to the time it's turned off:  Inductance is 1.05mH no I core, 1.18mH with I core at switch on position, 2.38mH with I core at switch off position and 4.85mH with full core in position. So if a gain of inductance can help the flyback to have more kick (to be proven), then this design will help with that also.
Anyways, the correct I core rotor saturation level will be important. The I core thickness may need to be twice the thickness then the ones I'm using to allow the full MOT's flux potential but for now it will be good enough for proof of concept.

Hope this helps you and others better understand where I'm going with this. Also, don't forget, the primary coil flyback will be going to the high impedance assist coils to further boost the torque of this non CEMF reluctance motor.

Luc

[Jimboot]

Jim mate, it looks to me your motor coil is a fine wire (HV) MOT secondary. Is this correct?

Luc

Yep MOT secondary Luc. I'm having better results now with a smaller cap. Thank Brad & Gyula. I have a condition called dickheadedness which manifests when I build circuits hence my DMM setting Gyula

[wattsup]

@gotoluc

OK, thanks for the bucking explain. I see that you consider this as a bucking effect and also understand that there is no relation between this and the standard bucking coils that are generally wound on a same core. Great.

Coils are wound on a core so you have the core layer that starts the winding and the outer layer that ends the winding.

A) The "pulse side" is the side of your parallel primaries that gets the make break, what ever it is - positive or negative of a source, applied to the coil at the core or outer layer.
B) The "always connected side" is the side of your parallel primaries that is always connected to source - positive or negative, applied to the coil at the core or outer layer.

So what I am trying to explain is that you add a third MOT primary in series to the two in parallel on the always connected side. This third one is just there sitting on the table and does not have to be mounted in any way on your wheel. Depending on which side is pulsed, these are the two possible ways;

                                           ====Primary 1====
----  pulsed on positive ---F--                                 ====Primary 3==== ----- constant negative------
                                           ====Primary 2====
or,

                                            ====Primary 1====
----  pulsed on negative --F---                                 ====Primary 3==== ----- constant positive------
                                            ====Primary 2====

OK, so where are you connecting your flyback diode? Using the above scheme, the flyback diode should come off the line where you see the letter F, that is between the pulse and the two parallel primaries.

So here are two questions for you guys about flyback.

1) If you run an electric motor or transformer with AC, A) is there flyback, or, B) is flyback strictly present after a DC pulse only?
2) If #1 is A or B or both, why?

wattsup