12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !

[hartiberlin]

Hi Hans,
do you know, if this pump can draw up the water from 12 Meters deep?

Also 36 Watts still needs a pretty big and expensive solar panel in clouds sky to really get 36 Watts
out constantly, especially in cloudy wintertime over here.

I just compared it, how much water I could draw from a street pump when I was a kid in the 1960s
how much physical body power I needed to draw this much water from the street pump.
You had to apply much more force than shown in this video by just giving it a little swing...

[tinu]

Hi Hans,
do you know, if this pump can draw up the water from 12 Meters deep?
...

That?s interesting!
Assuming water density at 1000kg/m3 and g rounded at 10m/s2, it would take exactly 40W to pump 1200l/hr from 12m deep. That?s for an ideal pump, of course.

Several questions arise:
1. Is a normal adult person able to deliver 40-50W? I?d say it is, even with one finger in a clever setup, but not for prolonged times. 50W is, in common terms, lifting 5kg to 1m in every second. For how long one can keep up with this effort rate? It depends on physical constitution but this is actually testable and some figures might, in principle, be brought into discussion. On the other hand, classical pumps require a great deal of force (because of small displacement) to achieve the same power. Not everyone is able to apply force over a threshold (especially a child) but nonetheless maybe some are able to expend great amounts of energy (i.e. children running, playing etc. all day long) thus achieving a reasonable mean power over the considered time interval.

2. Before water starts to pour out, the pendulum has to be swing for some time until reaching the designed working amplitude. Consequently, when Milkovic stops pumping, a lot of energy which already exists in the moving pendulum will be lost. It is unfortunate that neither one of these stages is shown in the videos, although they are part of the process and the energy loss may be quite significant if one only needs a small amount of water (i.e. a bucket of 10-12l).

3. By taking two pumps, one of which being classical and one of Milkovic type, it would take maybe just a ?barbecue contest? to have a fair resolution on which is better. Not to mention that both pumps may be electrically driven and scientifically compared.  Lack of such simple tests raises question about OU aspect. Nonetheless, the Milkovic device may be useful in the view of 1 above.

Cheers,
Tinu

[tinu]

deleted. double post.

[Talmin]

It is good comparation with the classic water pump.
I remember those pumps in my town too, it would be very hard to pump that after 2-3 minutes.

When we are talking about this, here are some videos showing how people pumping water in Africa even today:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWFjKq8NVQY

http://www.fotosearch.com/DVA007/052-0353/

[abassign]

Confirm that the power is 40W/s, but the the efficiency of a piston pomp should not overcome 50%. Moreover seem me strange 12 mt, a pomp as that in the film, it should not overcome the 7-8 meters of deep. There am hand pomps that can pump up to 10 mt, but they use other technologies.

Then it is probable that the deep meters are always 6-7 and the liters 1200/h. However the power should be of 40W (50% eff.). However the power should be of 40W (6 mt.) but non more 80W (12 mt.).

The power of 40-80W, developed with an only arm, for a man of average build is not small. Even if the hourly calories are bearable (600 -1200 kcal/h)

I am a lot of curiosity from this tape, more than from that of the light bulbs. It seems really an interesting device to be experimented.
However I don't understand because nobody has built an electric model to testing, in serious way, the characteristics of the device.