12 times more output than input, dual mechanical oscillation system !

[ChileanOne]

Gaby de wilde has shared an idea of the arched smot (http://gabydewilde.googlepages.com/new-smot)
to improve the effect of the energy gain because of the centrifugal force. I have been thinking how to make a "perpetual pendulum" to use in the Milkovic two stage oscillator, by using a ball and magnets built within the pendulum pestle, and I think that the arched smot design could be used in favour of gravity as a way to keep the ball going on, taking advantage of gravitational, centrifugal and magnetical forces. I attach an sketch, could this work? Please don't get mad at me if the idea sucks, this my first post in this forum.

[exnihiloest]

...Some of Milkoviks demos are to me unconvincing, because he seems not to take into account Work=force times distance...

Hi Neptune,

I agree with you. So in order to evaluate the system, we have to calculate this work.
Firstly we don't have to care the lever as it is a well known not OU system but it only transmits forces.
Secondly we "just" have to calculate the work that an oscillating pendulum could do when its rotation point moves along a vertical line.
Unfortunately, as even the movement equations of a simple pendulum are very complex to handle I'm afraid with the mathematics we would have to develop here.
We can make a first approximation: we may think that almost all the work is done when the pendulum is near vertical.
At this position it is known that the centrifugal pseudoforce can reach more than twice the weight of the pendulum. So the work done when the rotation point of the pendulum is sliding down along a distance h can be more than twice the work of its weight alone.
As the displacement is perpendicular to the motion of the pendulum mass, no work is made against this motion, so the kinetics energy is conserved, no loss on this side.
Nevertheless the pendulum is now lower so we lost a potential energy mgh.
Thus the final result of the energy gain should be around:
(Fc - mg)*h where Fc is the centrifugal force (Fc = m*v?/l where l is the length of the pendulum and v the speed of the mass).
As Fc > mg then we should have OU (it's the first time I think it should perhaps be possible :-).

[bigface]

Not much can be concluded from the video since we don't know the technical aspects of it, for example, how do we know that the pendulum weighs like 50 kg and the hammer only say 5 kg

[ChileanOne]

...Some of Milkoviks demos are to me unconvincing, because he seems not to take into account Work=force times distance...

Hi Neptune,

I agree with you. So in order to evaluate the system, we have to calculate this work.
Firstly we don't have to care the lever as it is a well known not OU system but it only transmits forces.
Secondly we "just" have to calculate the work that an oscillating pendulum could do when its rotation point moves along a vertical line.
Unfortunately, as even the movement equations of a simple pendulum are very complex to handle I'm afraid with the mathematics we would have to develop here.
We can make a first approximation: we may think that almost all the work is done when the pendulum is near vertical.
At this position it is known that the centrifugal pseudoforce can reach more than twice the weight of the pendulum. So the work done when the rotation point of the pendulum is sliding down along a distance h can be more than twice the work of its weight alone.
As the displacement is perpendicular to the motion of the pendulum mass, no work is made against this motion, so the kinetics energy is conserved, no loss on this side.
Nevertheless the pendulum is now lower so we lost a potential energy mgh.
Thus the final result of the energy gain should be around:
(Fc - mg)*h where Fc is the centrifugal force (Fc = m*v?/l where l is the length of the pendulum and v the speed of the mass).
As Fc > mg then we should have OU (it's the first time I think it should perhaps be possible :-).

Back on this thread is a link to a study of the forces in the pendulum, that states that at the maximum point if stress, the force exerted on the pendulum is 3 times it's weight. So, following your logic, this device is way OU.

[ChileanOne]

Not much can be concluded from the video since we don't know the technical aspects of it, for example, how do we know that the pendulum weighs like 50 kg and the hammer only say 5 kg

One of the obvious things about this set up for being able to evidence the phenomenon discussed is that the pendulum has to be in balance with the lever, so if the pendulum side weights 50 kg the lever side has to weight 50 kg. duh.