Getting energy from asymmetry of the magnetic field experiment

[sm0ky2]

So,
If I pull with 1Kg of force for 1 meter in half a second
This is the same acceleration as if I pull it in 1 second?
No, it is not. It is twice as fast.


In the half sec pull the acceleration is twice as fast.
It is accelerating 1kg @ 2m/s/s for 1m
Vs the 1 sec pull that accelerates 1kg @ 1m/s/s for 1m


You cannot have energy without time.
Convert it any way you want to.
Time is always in the equation.


If you negate time (as with a magnetic force) you have only
a timeless quantity: similar to weight.
Weight is not the energy imparted on you by gravity.
This only happens when you fall.
Your weight is only a force/pressure, not an acceleration force. Which is why it is in Lbs or Kg.



Connect your N meter spring scale to a normal weight scale
and move it to the reading your magnet gives you.
Now you have an accurate value of what you are measuring.
A pressure/force, in Lbs., timeless.
(Force measured in this way is not really force, also a spaceless dimension, so pressure is not the right term either)



Gravity has an inherent time constant.


Magnetism does not. Magnetic acceleration is mass dependent
and also depends on changes in the field, and direction of motion.
This time constraint must be measured or calculated to determine the acceleration.


Without acceleration you only have a constant pressure applied to the object.
it is the "weight" placed on that object by the magnetic field.


To imply an energy quotient to a force, there must be acceleration.
movement.
Distance over a time.


At no point can you just choose to ignore time.
Even in versions of the equation where time is not seen,
it is embedded into the variables. (such as acceleration)


Start with the energy value, and work the equation backwards
derive the time mathematically.


If there is movement, there is velocity. Distance / time
Change in velocity from no movement to movement over time
is acceleration. distance / time / time


Now take a 1Kg hunk of metal and move it 1 meter in 1 second
and watch your scales.


E=mc^2
E=mass x acceleration
E= mass x velocity x velocity [E=mass x distance/time x distance/time]
E= mass x distance / time / time


E does not = mass.
E does not = weight.


Magnetic fields are measured by strength. Not by energy.
The force is derived from the strength of the two interacting fields.
In your case these are the magnetic field and the secondary field induced
in the nut.


Movement of the nut changes the potential energy of the system.
Because the secondary field changes location within the magnetic field.
The field interaction equations handle the strength of the fields and give a
time-based acceleration force between them. If one field is fixed in space,
the force is applied to the movable field.


This is an acceleration: distance /time / time.
Which can be used to derive the final velocity after time x.
If you know the strength of the fields you can determine both
the potential energy change in the system caused by your motion
and the change in kinetic energy when you release the tension.


Knowing only the pressure at one location, and not having the other information
you cannot even calculate the energy.


The reading on your scale in the way you are trying to use it
is giving you a timeless value.
Plot individual points, and the scale readings
across a distance, with a set time interval of the motion.


Record the scales and play it back frame by frame for 1 second.
(however many frames per second your camera allows)


Fill in the equations and compare this to what you previously posted ^^^

[ayeaye]

So,
If I pull with 1Kg of force for 1 meter in half a second
This is the same acceleration as if I pull it in 1 second?

No, but it is the same energy. If with the same force it moves twice as fast, then there is likely much less mass.

> E=mass x acceleration

No,  force = mass x acceleration , not energy.

[sm0ky2]

The experiment itself proclaims that the forces are not the same at every distance.
Change in distance results in a change in the force of the field interactions.
There is a different acceleration at every distance (when one or more fields are not fixed).
If there is no motion, there is no energy.


You DO have a set value of energy stored in the spring.
But to know what this is, you need to know the field strength of the interacting magnets.
and the mass of the objects being moved
(we can ignore  the mass and motion of the spring for simplicity, since it moves itself to equilibrium)


The potential energy stored in the spring comes from YOU.
You placed that "energy" into the scales when you performed the experiment.
This is the energy it took your hand to pull the spring to that distance.
The field holding the spring at that reading is motionless at that point.
And is not accelerating.
The change in energy held in the spring occurred WHILE it was moving.


I will compound this further by stating you have no idea how much "extra energy"
your hand put into the spring above what was required to cause the motion.
You can't "feel" your hand's rate of acceleration.
You know there is an amount of potential energy stored in the spring
And you know that this can be equated to the same value of gravitational force required to
cause the same reading in a vertical plane.
So a comparison of the scales at a set measurement gives you a mass x gravity
And in this manner you know that 1N is 1N when it is stored in the spring.


For the purpose of the experiment you can glue the mass to the table.
and pull your springs to match the same reading.
You know there is 1N stored in the spring, but you may have used 2N to do that.
You don't know because you did not measure the acceleration.
You only measured the final force reading on the scales.

[ayeaye]

Ok, whatever, do your own calculations based on the video of the experiment, if you like. The video just shows what happens when you pull that magnet. But don't do that wrong. You know about science surprisingly lot, but please learn some elementary things about physics. Just take some time for that. I clearly showed where you were wrong. Please don't understand it wrongly, it doesn't make me happy to show that i'm smarter. But it will make me glad if you don't misunderstand.

See there, work  W = F * s , and it is energy, measured in the units of energy, F is force, s is distance  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Work_(physics) .

[kolbacict]

Well, this is what I have. But without a mechanical support at one point it does not work.
Or a spinning top.
https://youtu.be/ya1r--aSYiY