Reactive Current - Parallel RCL

[nix85]

This is not OU principle by itself but it's very important to thoroughly understand.

As you know, series LC is like short circuit at resonant frequency,
parallel LC just the opposite.

This is a very good video

Resonance and Q Factor in True Parallel RLC Circuits
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVOibkXeZs8

As you can see 0.02A of input current is used to produce 0.7A of reactive current.

Question is if this significant current gain can be achieved at higher currents without too big losses, for example to have input current of 1 amp and reactive current of 30-40 amp.

Other formulas for Q are Q=RsqrtC/L and Q=wRC. According to these formulas if we
decrease R or C, or increase L, gain decreases. Obviously goal is to decrease R to have
as little copper losses as possible but also to increase current gain as much as possible.

You see the obvious conflict there.

We might increase C more than we decrease R, and decrease L so we get high Q and
minimise copper losses, but keep in mind copper losses are current SQUARED x resistance, so i guess compromise needs to be found.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Q_factor#RLC_circuits

EDIT:

I suppose the above formulas are for ideal RLC where all three components are in
parallel, while in real RLC where R is in series with the inductance series RLC formula
is valid.

"In a parallel LC circuit where the main loss is the resistance of the inductor, R, in series
with the inductance, L, Q is as in the series circuit. This is a common circumstance for
resonators, where limiting the resistance of the inductor to improve Q and narrow the
bandwidth is the desired result."

[stivep]

This is not OU principle by itself but it's very important to thoroughly understand.

Since  OU - overunity is  a nonsense than there   is no OU principles
I suggest to use term FE ( free energy) - that is always completely correct 
as truth is that   you can have money and value and energy for free just because you  are special to someone or something.
But you will never,   and never ever have OU as you didn't have OU in the first place.
___________________________________

As you know, series LC is like short circuit at resonant frequency,
parallel LC just the opposite.

Think about it as:
- in series resonance  only 1 frequency is allowed to pass through  the door. All other frequencies are stopped
  and that  only open door is handling  all current , (all traffic)  flow.
  In reality it is  not  one frequency but -1 set of frequencies close enough to resonance - called bandwidth of the filter .( series filter) series-resonance

- in parallel resonance  All of the doors are open all frequencies are allowed to pass apart the only one - the frequency of 
  the parallel resonance that is not allowed  to pass and every  door  for this frequency is closed.

As you can see 0.02A of input current is used to produce 0.7A of reactive current.

No my friend:
_{-Current   in  series  elements  "produces"   losses  to  Power supply.
-but in parallel  branches  of that circuit Current  can be larger  ,
  ....so what?
At the end everything  is going to affect  the source  of energy.- the battery .( to be exact the battery that is powering generator)
that is connected in series with  the circuit.
so it is not current but  frequency of resonance that matters.
Current is dependent of  frequency and not reverse.
Frequency is the boss here.
  Resonance and Q Factor in True Parallel RLC Circuits
   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVOibkXeZs8}

Local parallel  branches  of the circuit, can behave locally as a "big guys,"
but  you can't ever have  connection of single power supply  in  parallel with the load or circuit. .
If you find such connection it will be only an illusion true  just from your observation point.
https://www.cui.com/blog/power-supplies-in-series-or-parallel-for-increased-power

if you think different  feel free to challenge me.

Wesley

[nix85]

Since  OU - overunity is  a nonsense than there   is no OU principles
I suggest to use term FE ( free energy) - that is always completely correct 
as truth is that   you can have money and value and energy for free just because you  are special to someone or something.
But you will never,   and never ever have OU as you didn't have OU in the first place.

Overunity is a good term, after all it's just semantics and not worth the useless ramble.

___________________________________Think about it as:
- in series resonance  only 1 frequency is allowed to pass through  the door. All other frequencies are stopped
  and that  only open door is handling  all current , (all traffic)  flow.
  In reality it is  not  one frequency but -1 set of frequencies close enough to resonance - called bandwidth of the filter .( series filter) series-resonance

- in parallel resonance  All of the doors are open all frequencies are allowed to pass apart the only one - the frequency of 
  the parallel resonance that is not allowed  to pass and every  door  for this frequency is closed.

Hah! Why there always has to be one captain obvious around is a phenomena in itself.

I know perfectly well all kinds of band pass/stop filters and their behavior, of course it is not just one frequency they pass/block but if Q is high enough it can get very close to one.

I already wrote about band stop filters here
https://www.electro-tech-online.com/threads/resonant-frequency-of-a-coil-or-lc-tank.160447/

No my friend:
_{-Current   in  series  elements  "produces"   losses  to  Power supply.
-but in parallel  branches  of that circuit Current  can be larger  ,
  ....so what?
At the end everything  is going to affect  the source  of energy.- the battery .( to be exact the battery that is powering generator)
that is connected in series with  the circuit.}

No, my friend, effective results is indeed that small current drawn from the battery is
producing greater reactive current in the RLC tank, and again sky is blue OF COURSE that small current is supplying energy lost due to friction and radiation.
And of course that small current is drawn from the battery.

so it is not current but  frequency of resonance that matters.
Current is dependent of  frequency and not reverse.
Frequency is the boss here.[/sub]
  _{Resonance and Q Factor in True Parallel RLC Circuits
   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zVOibkXeZs8}

Local parallel  branches  of the circuit, can behave locally as a "big guys,"
but  you can't ever have  connection of single power supply  in  parallel with the load or circuit. .
If you find such connection it will be only an illusion true  just from your observation point.
https://www.cui.com/blog/power-supplies-in-series-or-parallel-for-increased-power

if you think different  feel free to challenge me.

Wesley

This last part is specially ridiculous. Let's first look at this nonsense

"it is not current but  frequency of resonance that matters"
Frequency is the boss here."

Current amplification is exactly what matters in resonant parallel RLC just like
voltage amplification is in series RLC, and this gain is proportional to Q
and Q is given by formulas i noted above.

PS' in series and parallel is totally off the topic, we are talking reactive power here
with implication that (among other effects), IF everything is tuned just right,
reactive power can do real work. No need to mention Don Smith or this

https://overunity.com/9521/magnacoaster-vorktex/msg551466/#msg551466

Or many other schemes along similar lines where reactive power is used to tap
into subtler energies.

In in the name of effective forum behavior, do not waste server space on repeating
stuff or saying stuff that is totally obvious and well assumed.

[stivep]

Overunity is a good term, after all it's just semantics and not worth the useless ramble.

Mandatory definition
<sub>is - required by a law or rule  of physics.

The word has a meaning  even if it is your  pet name.
But in physics   general concept communicating the theory of a product is presented by  use of words having precise meaning and application. Although product  can be physically  present
- the theory used to explain the product may be overturned , by use  of just one word (e.g overunity.)
In your case  there is no product of overunity as  overunity  is not accepted in any theory recognized by physics 
nor is perpetual motion.
Overunity  - as you see this link doesn't even want to make use of word overunity .
overunity-free-energy-and-perpetual-motion- - these guys are just scrutinizes possibly financed also by
far Eastern Europe  regime. But they are often right on  the money.
But if you post there your critical view  challenging  promoted  "members" they will cut your comment  into unreadable gibberish .
compatible to Stalin time era.</sub>

___________________________________________________________

This last part is specially ridiculous. Let's first look at this nonsense
"it is not current but  frequency of resonance that matters"
Frequency is the boss here."

Current amplification is exactly what matters in resonant parallel RLC just like
voltage amplification is in series RLC, and this gain is proportional to Q
and Q is given by formulas i noted above.

_{No my friend}
there is no amplification at all in any form in resonant circuits RLC
<sub>Such  amplification  is  an illusion of  an uneducated experimenter but yes  you can see its  local value.
And voltage or  current response is only secondary phenomena when frequency  is tuned to resonance.
And if not than there is no  such phenomena taking place.

In any resonance circuit  LRC there is a rule :
resonate first and than radiate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbW-ZSR3Tx0
An antenna is a RLC resonant circuit but even in non-resonant  antennas you must  match that antenna impedance
by means of external resonant circuits that  are tuned to desired impedance 50 Ohm (standard)</sub>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jbW-ZSR3Tx0
https://youtu.be/A7LHDALBrV8?t=89
Here is   the evidence that transmatch must resonate first !!!!
look here:
https://www.elprocus.com/guide-on-resonant-rlc-circuits-working-and-application/

The q factor is reliant on the frequency it is most frequently quote for the resonant
frequency and the maximum energy stored in the capacitor and in the inductor

When frequency  from generator is tuned  to  resonance of  LRC circuit
or
the LRC circuit is tuned  to  the frequency of generator
the effect is always the same .
If tuning stops at frequency of resonance of LRC circuit  than
current or voltage is at its maximum ( depends from the character of  LRC circuit)
There is no amplification taking place there as  you see only presence of local phenomena characteristic to  the type of RLC circuit.


Look at the picture  below- Example A and B:
A:  in A you see that  impacting  force is applied  to  wide area  and damage to the hand  is not present.
B: in B you see that impacting force  is applied  to small area and it penetrates the hand.

Example B1:
B1:  in B1 the circuit is in series resonance  and  XL - Xc =0 (or it  balances.)

At the resonance : X L – X C = 0 or X L = X C.
https://circuitglobe.com/what-is-series-resonance.html
so when you have  0 impedance than there is only  small R(resistance) that  is not important.
The signal in full power  can now get out using that "door"
And yes Xc  and Xl  they have value  - locally only but in resonance their  value "cancels each other"
therefore there is no opposition and  entire  power of (the force) the signal in that particular frequency can pass.
(Minus small losses) 
_{note: please look at  B1 as if you were looking at  screen of spectrum analyzer.}



However power delivered to the LRC circuit will be always bigger  than  that  coming out from the circuit.( filter)
when  you have  big  current you have small voltage  , but power  is always the same
when  you have  small  current you have big voltage  , but power  is always the same
So there is no amplification taking place  at all ..  It is just losses that makes output power to be smaller.

___________________________________________________________
For  any other  reader:
If you think that your audio amplifier is amplifying anything it is just an illusion from standpoint of local observer.
In reality "amplification" is just  use of  power from your outlet to drive  another stage of the transistor  with bigger  voltage and/or current.

If you  recall magnetic amplifiers
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_amplifier
They have been very strong amplifiers but no discrete elements were used  at all.
- no tubes no transistors.

Did they amplify anything?
No they  didn't.
They were just  necessary to drive another  set  of transformers at  bigger  current and/or voltage .
But power used for the process  was always bigger than  power of amplified signal in Watts.
And yes you heard stronger sound.


_____________________________________________________

summary:
Because our expectation is  to gain in something  that will give us  FE
The easiest way  is to couple to  wealthy  uncle.

So only  coupling to  energy that doesn't cost us money  will give you FE.
and that is why nonsense   of "overunity"  should be eliminated  as confusing these who don't yet  understand  as much as you are my friend

Wesley

[lancaIV]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transistor


Because the controlled (output) power can be higher than the controlling (input) power, a transistor can amplify a signal.


wmbr