Is this the first selfrunning overunity motor w/o batteries ? Mike?s motor

[z_p_e]

I?ve ordered the Crouzet relay now and can?t wait to start playing with that.

SPP-48,

If you look at Mike's video closeup of the dual ssr, you will see something odd...the 2 connections made on the ssr are not correct.

On both single and dual ssr's, the switch contacts are on the ends of the device where the "D" notches are. In Mike's video, he has  connected to one terminal of SWA, and one terminal of SWB. Since the other two terminals are not connected, there is no way he is switching anything through this relay.

Darren

PS. Someone correct me if I am wrong please. I have checked the spec sheets for these relays. In the pic of Mikes setup with the new relay, it appears to be connected correctly.

[joe_1001101]

Mike is not using a new style relay.  His SSR in the video is hooked up wrong.  Look very close at how new relays look compared to Mikes.  It's easy to see.

[z_p_e]

Is there anyone here still interested in Mike's motor???

By the lack of activity, it seems to have died. I guess I'll stop posting then.

Darren

[hartiberlin]

Hi All,
here are very encouraging reports of user EMdevices.

from user EMdevices


Re:The Bedini - Cole Window Motor - 2007/03/06 00:45
Hi everyone,

I took a photo for your enjoyment

1000 RPM running from 3.5 volts, current draw around 0.35 Amps.

Generator function is not yet fully connected

I'm only using motor pulse recycling (see diode)

The circuit is very simple as you can see, only one transistor and diode!! Mike could of done the same thing.

When I connect my generator function, OFF OF THE TRIGGER WINDING, all I'm adding will be the rectifier bridge!!!

The only reason for the 3 transistors in the original John Cole circuit was to work with 2 windings, but if more are used, there's no need for 3.

Also note I separated my trigger from motor pulse, no need to have them together, interactions develop and feedback that is not necessary, better to keep the functions separate.

But most importantly, NO NEED FOR HUGE WASTE OF WIRE. lol Theres a 'N' and a 'S' pole right next to each other, why go around to the other side and waste wire?

My bearings are very lossy. If I disconnect the power it stops in about 4 seconds, Once I hook up to new bearings I'm ready for "loop closure"

I'll post a complete circuit soon.

EM

And the wonderful simple circuit.

Resistance, number of loops, have the biggest influence on the opperating point of this Generator and Motor, in one unit.

Where the two forces from the Generator and Motor are equal, we have the operating point. It can be controlled very precisely, ASSUMING ONE KNOWS HOW TO DO THE ANALYSIS. I might show that one of these days.

That's right Rich, I have an inline resistor you can't see in the coil

In my previous posting with the motor I said I don't have the generator function FULLY implemented.

Two Generator functions exist.

1) The pulse to the coil to attract a pole, has current in an inductor and when the transistor shuts off this is captured back. I use this in the picture, the diode is there.

2) The generator coil acts like any old generator. This is captured from my trigger coil (plays a double role) and this flows through the rectifier bridge, NOT SHOW in the photo, so you're correct.

EM

P.S. I connected the generator function and pulled the POWER, and it struggled for about 20 seconds and then rapidly died, SO I'M SO FREAKING CLOSE, THOSE DAM BEARINGS GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR


Another photo with motor stoped showing the magnets.

By the way, the RPM is about 1200 running off of only 3.5 volts (previously I mentioned 1000)

It spins and roars like a little devil

I need to start looking for those jewel bearings, good idea Rich.

EM

Hi Ben,

very good mention of those other losses. (diodes, transistor, etc..) Right now my biggest power drainer is the BEARINGS, because ....

I did tests and I can get a backEMF recycling efficinecy of about 90%

I used the same coil in a Blocking Oscillator configuration to do DC2DC conversion. Works wonderful!!!

AND IN MY MOTOR, I PULSE AT THE CORRECT TIME (ANGLE) WHEN THERE IS NO VOLTAGE INDUCED FROM ROTOR MOTION. !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

SO I'M NOT DUMPING POWER INTO A backEMF VOLTAGE (backEMF produced or induced by magnet motion).

THIS IS THE SECRET TO ALL THESE MOTORS, I SPOTED THAT FROM MIKES SCOPES A WHILE AGO, BUT WAITED TO SEE IF ANYBODY PICKED UP ON THAT, BUT IT LOOKS LIKE ONLY TAO, was on it with his JNL posting. Good for you tao, you sharp guy, when this is all over we'll have to toast!!.

So yes, this was my first atempt. Now I'm redesigning. New bearings and .... <drum roll>..... Neodymium Magnets !! I know I know, I said before not to use them, but you have to know why and how, and I know that. Stronger magnets allow for smaller loops and LESS RESISTANCE LOSS, at a particular speed. Way more efficient. The bedini cole circuit suffered because that resistor and diode arangement burned so much power like Peter pointed out and like I also mentioned early on in this madness

Keep up the enthusiasm guys !!!! The site is back as well, thanks Rich, had me worried there for a few days.

EM

P.S. Oh, you mentioned air losses, yes very good point, I need to put some tape over the magnets to minimize that as well. I don't have a good feel for how significant these losses are right now. Also, the generator coil WILL SLOW DOWN THE ROTOR, that's given, but HOW MUCH? There is a curve where the voltage drop due to drop in speed causes equilibrium, and that's where it will operate. Another way to control how much generator function is applied is to do what Mike did, with a hall sensor and switch and only turn the generator coil on for a small fraction of one revolution, sort of like a generator duty cycle. But if one does the analysis ahead of time they can find the operating point.

Ok, here's a curve showing the current in an inductor when we apply a set voltage. Most of you know this already, so bear with me.

What's important in efficiency is to operate in the bottom or linear region, before the current gets too high and the resistance of the windings start to drop the voltage "too much" which is arbitrary and plays into efficiency of DC2DC converters etc..

Just thought it might help, in the balancing act, like John said. We're walking the fence line here folks, carefull not to fall, ahhhhhhh, wowwww..

take care guys,

I'm going silent for a while, very busy at work, and I got this new motor to redesign.

EM





Gentlemen,

One more posting before I go away for a while.

Thanks Rob for the Bearing suggestion, it was you who suggested that first I belive. I shall see if I can get a hold of a meter.

Here's one drawing that will help everyone understand.

TOO MUCH GENERATOR ACTION AND IT WILL NOT WORK.

Look at the graph. I also modifyed my original circuit slightly and made it be only a HALF WAVE BRIDGE rectifier. Cuts the generator action by half and lowers the slope of the generator curve. If that's not enough for a set of coil parameters, we can also implement a switch and hall sensor arangement where we turn the generator ON FOR AN EVEN SHORTER TIME PERIOD LIKE MIKE DID.

By the way, this is not the only curve one can draw for a motor, there's other considerations like efficiency of coils, duration of pulse, etc.. This is just to give everyone a general visual idea of what we're working with.

Hope that helps everyone,

Sincerely,

EM

P.S. Please keep these drawings and circuits here at gn0sis.com Much appreciated!!
Also, I should add, if the generator curve is too low, it will not charge the capacitor fast enough and the voltage will drop, AND THE TORQUE CURVE WILL SHIFT DOWN. So this is a very fine balance or narrow window. One thing effects another. But there is a sweet spot. Most important, get the motor to work as efficiently as possible and to recyle it's pulses, maybe at 90% efficinecy or higher. Then play with the generator curve, and also minimize friction wherever possible. And of course timing plays a big part, which is where the secret is at

[hartiberlin]

P.S: user EMdevices gave me permission to copy it over to here.
He will shorlty add a bigger documentation of it all.

@Darren,
please keep at it and keep us updated on your progress,
Many thanks.