Successful TPU-ECD replication !

[turbo]

This thread is starting to look like a cheap soap.

and Rich, you would be the king of pc heroes, i have never seen you build a single coil or posting a image as my memory serves me right 

did you get the generators and finish your ECD type TPU ?
i am intrested in your results.

The people who are waiting for the right tpu diagram are heading towards a verry hard time if/when it becomes available that would mean they start to build their first coil and then they will face all the things the others faced much earlier becuse they did various coils and develloped certain winding techniques.

i don't think one can wind the perfect coil when it is his first one, you really need to get the experience and you will get better as you build more coils.

Marco.

[giantkiller]

OK then guys, Back on track.

This is a conversation between Ronotte, Gnosis and I. I cleaned up the spelling and left the pertinant items in.

[1:02:42 AM] Ronotte says: OK. Me & Otto lately are pushing hard as with standard design Bobbin or flat coil doesn't seem to allow more power extraction than a single lamp! no matter what you do. So especially Otto lately discovered that we do need to use much less copper....and then he PARALLELED MANY LAMPS WITHOUT NOTICING VOLTAGE DECREASING!
[1:03:22 AM] Giantkiller says: sounds like SM to me!
[1:04:14 AM] Giantkiller says: I could drive the ECD now with my 1st driver board. But I want to take more steps up front.
[1:05:00 AM] Ronotte says: YES it is the same for me too. But as always it is necessary to confirm. At the moment I'm striving to go in parallel with Otto...unfortunately he's able to experiment more because he has more free time...so he is always a step or 2 in front of me!!
1:07:21 AM] Giantkiller says: my fet duty cycle is less than 10%
[1:07:53 AM] Giantkiller says: And they run cold with a 50 ohm load phase to zero lines.
[1:07:58 AM] Ronotte says: Things are now going faster and is more and more difficult to stay in phase!   As you have seen many new theories are emerging...but my advice is just to take a route and follow it without being distracted too much by the others!
[1:09:04 AM] Giantkiller says: Absolutely. But I always like to hear that advice again.
[1:10:07 AM] Giantkiller says: I got the fets running way below body temp. 4 fets at 10ma with coil and 50ohm attached. I did the calculation and the ECD doc shows 884 ohms. I should be very good to go. I'll switch to a 1k for the next test.
[1:13:10 AM] Ronotte says: giantkiller would you be so nice to update the other friends here as it seems that I never catch them. Speaking about my new advance ...I've set up a second bobbin and done a complete set of tests. Well the results are not encouraging as the single bobbin seem much better than the two. This means that there is something wrong in the CC design, I do think I'll try the new low turn number way: do you remember? Gustav22 told us with a good calculus about copper that the resonance with copper atomic structure (25 MHz) may be reached with 1/4 of wave with a length of 1.9 meter of coil wire.
[1:14:21 AM] Gnosis says: Roberto, it could also be that the number of coils matters.
[1:14:40 AM] Giantkiller says: yes I do. That told me the best freq that matches copper as an element.
[1:14:53 AM] Gnosis says: I would try adding another coil, before abandoning what you are doing. The single coils test is very encouraging.
[1:15:02 AM] Gnosis says: perhaps three are needed. for some reason.
[1:15:07 AM] Gnosis says: Asymmetry
[1:15:30 AM] Giantkiller says: Yes. 2 equals just rocking back and forth.
[1:15:37 AM] Gnosis says: right
[1:16:03 AM] Giantkiller says: that is the 390721 bucking coil test.
[1:16:30 AM] Ronotte says: Perhaps you are right! I've also had that thought...but anyway I'll try as well with 3 CCs...To summarize what I see with 2 CCs is that I' don't reach even near a full conversion and all tuning is more complicated. So I will not dismantle that test bench...but in the same time I'm building a new more advanced (') ECD with at least 3 Mobius. I DO WANT POWER.
[1:18:15 AM] Giantkiller says: I agree.
[1:18:20 AM] Gnosis says: will your three rings be the same diameter?
[1:18:33 AM] Gnosis says: Or will they get smaller as you go down, like the two rings?
[1:18:46 AM] Giantkiller says: or bigger?
[1:19:12 AM] Ronotte says: NO , this route has been discussed with Otto and we thought that it should run with 3 big ring and 1 small ring on top
[1:19:26 AM] Gnosis says: interesting
[1:20:07 AM] Giantkiller says: so 2 more 6"s
[1:20:47 AM] Giantkiller says: I know the mobius configuration works from before.
[1:21:40 AM] Ronotte says: So there is plenty of ground to use and help from the Team is absolutely needed...I can think about other at least 40 - 50 configurations to test.....BUT I FORGOT TO SAY THAT OTTO USING LESS COPPER HAS BEEN ABLE TO LIGHT MANY LAMPS WITHOUT INCREASING POWER SUPPLY CURRENT!!!!!
[1:22:31 AM] Giantkiller says: I do believe it is the wing configuration
[1:23:06 AM] Gnosis says: how many turns are Ottos controls now roberto?
[1:23:38 AM] Gnosis says: 1.9 meters is not that much
[1:23:56 AM] Ronotte says: It seems that he's using a figure near the one I'm going to use  1.9 meter that translates into 15 turns of lamp wire
[1:24:18 AM] Gnosis says: your controls are now lamp wire?
[1:24:22 AM] Gnosis says: not mag wire?
[1:24:42 AM] Ronotte says: not at the moment, but I'll switch to it
[1:24:46 AM] Giantkiller says: that would be an open tpu
[1:24:58 AM] Gnosis says: I have litz
[1:25:03 AM] Gnosis says: from some transformers
[1:25:52 AM] Ronotte says: YES it is because I'll wind the lower ring around an annular Al disk and I'LL PUT THE moSFET ON AN UPPER RING OF cU METAL, Than flat coil =  OPEN TPU
[1:27:00 AM] Ronotte says: ...but it takes time ...and this only AFTER we all have seen that other routes leads to nothing
[1:27:07 AM] Giantkiller says: the flat style gives 2 wing edges, inside and outside.
[1:27:36 AM] Ronotte says: yes and you have to lay down the collector near one border
[1:28:04 AM] Giantkiller says: and the concentrated RE in the center gives us alot to work with in the magnetic field creation.
[1:28:46 AM] Ronotte says: YES and don't forget to make winding AROUND an annular Al disk to provide for particles release!!!!
[1:29:15 AM] Gnosis says: Have you tried different methods of wiring the controls together?
[1:29:16 AM] Giantkiller says: but the mag field is almost like car engine exhaust.
[1:29:33 AM] Ronotte says: what do you mean?
[1:30:53 AM] Gnosis says: Well, the primaries have the input signal and power, one side and power to ground. basically all in parallel, but from different signal sources, same power source though.
[1:30:54 AM] Giantkiller says: the RE is what the true power out for conversion. The mag field is slower and less necessary. Could be helpful for a buffer or resistance of operation.
[1:31:11 AM] Gnosis says: err other side to ground.
[1:32:18 AM] Gnosis says: Secondaries also are all in parallel
[1:32:30 AM] Giantkiller says: yep
[1:32:35 AM] Gnosis says: SM talked about different ways to do it.
[1:32:46 AM] Gnosis says: depending on how you wanted the power output.
[1:32:47 AM] Giantkiller says: strange circuit.
[1:32:54 AM] Gnosis says: more current, or more voltage
[1:33:03 AM] Giantkiller says: IT starts with RE
[1:33:08 AM] Gnosis says: if secondaries were all in series, that might be interesting.
[1:33:17 AM] Ronotte says: In actual CC (many turns) I have lot of RE , peak conversion take place easily...eliminating those huge peaks and make appearing sine wave pieces. The CCs are all in series...but current consumption is still high
[1:33:21 AM] Gnosis says: then to zero and phase
1:33:45 AM] Giantkiller says: right to both of you.
[1:34:42 AM] Giantkiller says: The GK4 has a tremendous amount of RE out. But I made it sloppy and can't tune it.
[1:34:44 AM] Ronotte says: Well ...there still is an important clue!  ..use a rot mag field on Mobius!
[1:34:54 AM] Gnosis says: yes, yes.
[1:35:20 AM] Giantkiller says: absolutely. That is fact and will never go away in my mind.
[1:35:38 AM] Gnosis says: I was thinking about some other experiments I saw somewhere.
[1:35:53 AM] Ronotte says: This is the most important thought I had ...I've definitely have to setup a Tesla pat  with 4 CC to try it
[1:36:05 AM] Gnosis says: Where in several transformers, they placed the primaries in series, and the secondaries all in parallel.
[1:36:10 AM] Giantkiller says: the 390721?
[1:36:14 AM] Ronotte says: Yes
[1:36:35 AM] Giantkiller says: You will like what you see!
[1:36:43 AM] Ronotte says: I already have made such a ring I've only to fire it up
[1:37:08 AM] Giantkiller says: When the current fet board is done I bring them all back out.
[1:37:51 AM] Ronotte says: Probably the best would be to use 3 Mobius and a rot field...low turn-count coils
[1:38:18 AM] Giantkiller says: You just have to get the RE flying. I have 3 coils that do that now.
[1:38:48 AM] Ronotte says: I DO WANT BECAUSE IS JUST THE TIME THIS TEAM GETTING HIS REWARD!
[1:39:14 AM] Giantkiller says: yes sir.
[1:39:34 AM] Gnosis says: are you planning another trip any time soon to croatia?
[1:40:05 AM] Ronotte says: Please would you be so kind to update the other members as it seems I've difficult to find them due to much different timings.
[1:40:29 AM] Ronotte says: YES I'll go to Croatia during the second part of August
[1:40:31 AM] Giantkiller says: sure.
[1:41:14 AM] Gnosis says: awesome. I hope you bring back new documentation.
[1:42:04 AM] Ronotte says: of course I'LL TRY TO SETUP CORRECTLY EVERYTHING AND TO ASSESS THE SITUATION
[1:42:13 AM] Ronotte says: cIAo

I can edit out more of what is deemed not neccesary.

--giantkiller.

[turbo]

well, which part is deemed neccesary?

M.

[otto]

Hello all,

@GK

thanks a lot for sharing your discussion. Veeery nice.

Otto

[giantkiller]

You are welcome, Sir.

--giantkiller.