Energy from Still Air

[Dingus Mungus]

So what you're stating is the compression of air is a biased endothermic reaction? If not, what should I google to get that info from "professors at MIT, Harvard, UCLA, Stanford or any of the top Universities"? I'm just confused how it'll cause global cooling. The air is compressed by a mechanical source right? A biproduct of the pressure is heat, all the losses in the compressor are heat, the energy that powered the compressor had heat losses, using a resistor to collect power from the expanding gas is a heat loss, yet the release of the gas and its decompession temp drop will exceed all of the heat losses required to fill the tank. In a more to the point example, any electricity not converted back in to kinetic or electrical energy is heat loss, and even if you did convert all 100% of the electrical input energy to kinetic any friction is also a heat loss. I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm only saying I don't understand how that would be possible. Please explain it more. Maybe walk us through a cycle of the devices operation.

~Dingus Mungus

[ltseung888]

Please read the attached file on the top post of this thread.
Energyfromair1.doc (68 KB)

In the last diagram (the energy Picture), Please note that the
Input Energy has two terms: one is Pump Energy, the other is Energy of Air In.

The Output Energy also has two terms: one is usable energy, the other is Energy of Air Out.

The exact mechanism is as follows:
(1) In a simple beach pump, there are two one-way valves.  One allows air to get into the pump chamber (Valve In).  One allows air to get to the machine or tube with one-way valves (Valve Out).
(2) In the initial position, there will be air in the pump chamber.  When one presses on the pump, work is done.  The air from the pump chamber goes into the machine via Valve Out.  Some compression will take place.  We refer to this as the Pump Energy.

(3) When the hand is released, Atmospheric Pressure will force open the Valve In.  Air goes into the pump chamber.  Note that no work needs to be done by the hand.  This incoming air will have Pressure approximately equal to atmospheric and the Volume will be approximately equal to the pump chamber.
(4) Step (1) is repeated. There will be some work done in raising the air+water column up.  But the air in the tube between the one-way valves will be compressed. To be exact, the pressure downwards on a one-way valve in the tube is the Pressure of Air in Tube + Water Pressure in that portion of the Tube. 
(5) This Pressure of Air in Tube is higher than Atmospheric.

(6) At the highest position, air+water will come out.  This mixture will seperate.  The air will expand - thus Cooling Effect is achieved.  This is also confirmed by actual experiments.

In addition, the Energy of Air In need not be equal to Energy of Air Out.  This difference can be used to do work.  This is in addition to the Pump Energy supplied.

The above information was presented by Professor Wu from our group when he went to Harvard University in 2005.  The website is:
http://www.energyfromair.com

[hanker886]

Hmmm...we talk about "Chi". "Chi Gong".  Take a deep breath and feel the power...

[Dingus Mungus]

Ok now I can sort of understand where you're coming from...

Heat pumps use a similar technique by using a "low pressure zone" of boiling liquid gas to collect heat from the outside enviornment and in turn provide excess heat to the "high pressure zone". They have an average CoP>2... Because they produce so much extra heat!

You're esentially using air as a refrigerant then, your plan is to compress/heat a HPZ of water and air, thats brought in from the LPZ (the enviornment), and when this high temp/pressure liquid/gas is squeezed through an expansion valve the released fluid/gas is cooler than when it entered.

Now back to my point... What happens to all the heat from the compressed HPZ? Note that the heat radiating from the HPZ is equivlent to the incoming airs original temp plus the pressure is converted to heat and any and all losses of the step where work is done as well. If heat is not converted to some other form of energy, than its exchanged with the nearest cooler molecule. Energy can not be created or destroyed, so where is all the heat going? While heat is energy, just because you take in warm air and blow out cold air does not mean the overall temperature exchange has has dropped the ambient temp or that you've obtained that energy. It's like you said air is an energy carrier, all you're doing in the device desciption is telling the air to come on in and drop off all its heat in your HPZ! The heat still has to go some where.

I've reviewed the web site and can not find any physical prototypes or experimental logs. Its a bunch of box diagrams with inane "physics looking" stuff. Claiming things like a no loss perpetual pendulums with no proof (not even a drawing) just the physics-ish box diagram explanation nothing more. Also when I load the attached document it says can not load graphics filters... Anyone else having that problem as well?

I just want to know where all the heat goes???
And if you convert it to another kind of energy which one and how?

Sorry if I sound short, but look over your own posts you still have not explained where energy is havested in the device, or what happens to the heat... It's like you dodged the two most important issues all together.

~Dingus Mungus

[ltseung888]

Dear Dingus Mungus,

I see that you are focusing on the heat aspects of the machine.

Let me first talk about the work done by the machine.  Water is delivered to a great height.  The energy required is mgh.  The water goes up as part of the air+water fluid.  If we do a careful calculation and controlled experiment on the input pump energy (a one-tenth horse power air pump was used in our demonstration in Dec 2004), we would find that it could not account for the amount of energy required for the water delivered to the greater height (four floors.)

If the air pump did not provide all that energy, where does the extra energy come from?  (Answer: Energy from Still Air)

The same or similar experiments have been repeated dozens of times in Hong Kong, Shenzhen, Beijing and other parts of China.  I believe Professor Wu also did it at Harvard and MIT Universities.  Mr. Raymond Ting in Hong Kong has a working demonstration in his factory.  That device could deliver water to 14 floors.

Now let us focus on the heat side.  We measured the air temperature at the bottom floor and at the top floor when there were no delivery of water.  There were no appreciable difference.  We then put our thermometer at the outlet at the top where the air+water fluid came out.  The temperature dropped by a few degrees.

The experiment is extremely easy to do and repeat.  I can specify the exact beach pump, the size of the tubes, the number and spacing of the one-way valves, etc. if you are interested in repeating.  I can ask Mr. Ting to provide the pictures of every component etc.