New guy on Free energy

[Eminent]

=) that was some great read there steve..  I really enjoyed that..Now, I actually feel that I now know what this whole thing is about.. proving those physics wrong..  "Lalalala"< haaha gotta love that part..

Yes, you're right, when I first entered this forum, I felt like I was overwhelmed with all these different types of "things" but nothing to introduce me to what it is..

Now that you mentioned the 3 types of energy, I guess the best way for me is to focus on one of my interest.. I guess what Im really most interested about is combining fields(magnets) and motion.. Because this is what my design consist off..  where should I start my read? there are so many of them, I guess itll be great if you can point me to a right direction lol..

[Eminent]

Thanks for a great point Mrmamos..  Ive read around the forum and I do believe on the better results of open source as in sharing and working with people is the best way to speed up technology..  But I also wonder how patent things work..  Do we have to read up on all the patent ideas and make sure not to do them as it is already patented?? is this allowed??

If people were to share new infos about new designs which isnt yet patented, what makes another person steal that idea and patent it as his/her own before it gets patented?? Can the person who actually made the first design do anything legally to claim his/her rights with the device/project?

Just some questions..

[steve_whiss]

..patenting. well.

OK, if you have an idea and someone else patents it - and you CAN prove it was your idea + they stole it - you get to win a court case. If you can afford to go to court.

Why do people steal? The promise of money. To stop other people's progress. To horde breakthroughs. To be a economic weapon that THEY control vs. competitors. Ultimately, because there may never be a downside.


I'm going to ramble on about patents some.

The original idea was to stop people carrying ideas to the grave (many old / medieval concepts became lost on the death of the "master" who kept the secrets close to the chest). Progress was terribly hindered by this, a genuine drag on the economy.

Patents are now a double edged sword. To combat the hording of secrets, patents allow publishing works - so that the originator (= patentee??) can stake a claim.

But. It has to be original / non-obvious i.e. not already known .... in other words, a true advance and useful.

Who can tell if this is so? The patent office clerk cannot known all engineering, so the responsibility is up to the patentee (and common sense). A lot of patents get retrospectively thrown out.

Plus. IF a 3rd party starts infringing the patent - the original patentee gets to win a court case. Because THEY hold the patent. However, they must have the $$ to pay the legal people during the case - and, they might loose....

Like when Swan sued Edison over the light-bulb (courts of New York, 1878 if memory serves). Edison lost - as he was basically ripping off Swan's ideas.

// the light bulb idea was already known about 40 years - just stuff lots of power through most anything - it WILL glow! And melt / fuse.

The trick - stop the thing fusing; Swan had found a way and had patented it //


What did Swan do? (with the court) he entered into a merger of Edison's Co. with his own business. Essentially the courts handed Swan a chunk of Edison's $ss - because Edison had seen a way to become very rich and had lunged for it - on the back of someone else's work.


Now the other side of the sword.

All patents are inspected for strategic usefulness (military). All such strategic patents "disappear", the patentee has a binding order issued against them forcing them to yield all such technology, drop development and keep quiet.

The patent then never gets published.

Why? To stop the bad guys getting their hands on it. BIG case in point.....

Whittle patented the Jet Engine concept in the early 1930's - and this was picked up by Heinkel, simply by watching patents, looking for power plants for fast aircraft. Result - Nazi Germany picked up a new design for advanced engines - and flew a series of modern jets as early as 1938 (? think so) on. Germany could have rolled out a fleet of Me262 variants as early as 1941, but H decided to put $$ on the V2 rocket instead. Hm, the '262's that did fly really chopped up the Allied bombers - it was just that far ahead and simply unstoppable. H could have said - build them by the hundred!

Now, if that Whittle patent had never been issued, Heinkel would not have had a working start point for jet development; in practice no jet would have seen combat. This was a hair breadth thing - with fleets of 262's (which were buildable) the air war would have gone the Nazi way.

No Allied air-superiority = who knows? No big bombing campeigns, no crippled German economy, no Normandy invasion for sure.

Perhaps Russia would have collapsed, Britain loose in '42-3 and the Brit Empire (then 1/4 planet, including Canada) go Nazi. Roosevelt had an eye on the map when aiding Britain; the US might have faced Axis powers = rest of world including Continental American soil. Bad guys over the boarder + very high tech and a population of c. 600 million about the world to muster armies from? That's a bad sign. Roosevelt did not want that future. No wonder the scramble was on to make a nuke.


All because of a patent - this whole thing was a nightmare. Nowadays, the military ARE in the loop.

Thus we have a conundrum! Are FE devices real and suppressed by "the process"? If one turned up - we would be the last to know.

Anyhow, anyone can read and build something patented - the patent only protects "making money from the idea". You can build anything patented - for your own use - it's legal.

In the EU at least.

I just do not know about Open Source designs. Suppose a manufacturer spends $5 million to design and set up a production line - will they ever get their money back? With no patent protection, IF it sells others will rip the ideas off and undercut (not having to sponsor the development costs).

I think we need a new law, an open limited protection. Like, OS but 1st 10 years protected. Have not got my head about this yet; suspect it's 100% a legal invention thing.


Still thinking about a suggested reading list. It might be a very constructive idea; there are lots of books out there and many free downloads....

Good luck!

Steve

[Eminent]

Nice Nice.. haha you guys always write such a great read replies.. 

Im really not afraid to "jump in" as I know im quite new at this and the probability of me inventing one that people actually want to steal is very slim..  I was just interested on how this open source can protect the originator of lets say a device that is still half baked(because of that persons newbieness)..  Someone(the newbie) who have near by completed a project but still needed some tweaks in order for it to work..  Discussing it with the forum I find will be a great incentive to find help.. Now what if another person who knows alot more about electronics was able to figure out the tweaks needed, and patents it..  the newbie jus got screwed?

I guess the only way to protect or prove in the court that the idea was yours is by sending yourself a copy of the blueprint or documentations that you made via package and get it stamped by post office and do not open the package.. (I saw it in a movie hahaha)..

btw steve, i gotta say i enjoyed the history lesson haha..  I think by taking it[idea/device] to public like steorn did (like going to TV News etc) to get interviewed for the whole public to be aware off will decrease the chances that they can be shut down? but unfortunately with steorn, very unlucky situation happened.. lol..

you say that building something patented for own use is legal, but what if you built something you didnt know was patented and try to bring it out to the public, would you get sued for that??