Selfrunning cold electricity circuit from Dr.Stiffler

[DrStiffler]

@Dr. Stiffler,
Neon 101.5F, 22uH 88F, Transistor 82F, 10uH 81F.
Sound a little more like it?

Oh...wait.......102.5 with supply current GOING DOWN! HOLY FREAKING SHIT! How do things get hotter with supply current decreasing. 

I'm late.....SHIT!

Best regards,

Jim

@Loki
Well I think you are now getting close to the hard work

Need to transfer the circuit to something that will fit inside a calorimeter and still have it putting out heat. A slight problem now is how to build a small calorimeter that will make the crowd somewhat happy in the readings, if not accepting.

@All
In our calorimetry results something sticks out and remains to be resolved. When the whole circuit is placed in a chamber (insulated) with a heat exchanger, the chamber of course heats along with the other mass used in the construction. Now the circuit heats as the chamber heats and we have found that (at first) a great volume of heat is detected, then it starts to tapper off as the chamber increases in temperature. So far the idea is that the circuit is being detuned, capacitor shifting value, transistor specs changing, etc., but now what about if the transistor is doing some left field impossible thing like cooling? Could it be that there is a cooling that offsets the heat and thereby explaining the decline as time moves forward. Just a thought now and adding to what is taking place that we see such a beginning output that then starts to decline.

Food for thought and exploration!! as it still is not known if any cooling is really present.

[fritz]

just for reference:

Copper has a positive temperature coefficient of
approx 0.4% per Kelvin, alpha=3.9e-3.

Don?t know if using Konstantan (Cu84Ni4Mn12) is
an option for the coils. alpha +/- 0.04e-3

hfe of the MPSA06 might have a positive temperature
coefficient of up to 15e-3/K.

rgds.

[Pirate88179]

Dr. Stiffler:

This is possibly a stupid question but, in view of the calorimetry anomalies you are experiencing why could you not just continue to use your hand-held temperature sensor?  What I mean by this, and I know they are not totally accurate, is if every component on the sec device is at ambient temperature prior to any test, and then you run it and take temperature readings of all of the components, including the transistor, any deviation from the baseline ambient would require a power output would it not?  Say the transistor is 3 degrees cooler than it was at the beginning of the test, well that shows power output right, as in a peltier junction?  I guess what I am getting at is that it takes energy to heat or cool something (to change its temperature state) and by adding up all of the changes (+ or -) of all the components, I would think this would give you a more accurate look at what is going on than having the transistor's cooling negate the heat you are making elsewhere.  Feel free to delete this if you think it is too stupid a suggestion as it could quite possibly be.  Thanks.

Bill

[DrStiffler]

Dr. Stiffler:

This is possibly a stupid question but, in view of the calorimetry anomalies you are experiencing why could you not just continue to use your hand-held temperature sensor?  What I mean by this, and I know they are not totally accurate, is if every component on the sec device is at ambient temperature prior to any test, and then you run it and take temperature readings of all of the components, including the transistor, any deviation from the baseline ambient would require a power output would it not?  Say the transistor is 3 degrees cooler than it was at the beginning of the test, well that shows power output right, as in a peltier junction?  I guess what I am getting at is that it takes energy to heat or cool something (to change its temperature state) and by adding up all of the changes (+ or -) of all the components, I would think this would give you a more accurate look at what is going on than having the transistor's cooling negate the heat you are making elsewhere.  Feel free to delete this if you think it is too stupid a suggestion as it could quite possibly be.  Thanks.

Bill

@Pirate88179
I wish it were easy as it might sound, yet unless you totally isolated the device under test within an Adiabatic container and knowing its specific heat value and confirming after some form of calibration, the measurements are meaningless. The surrounding environment most likely will be at a temperature less than the device under test, therefor energy will flow from the higher to the lower. This difference must be accounted for. Drafts, ambient heat, device color and positioning to other objects much be taken into consideration.

A good example would be Loki in his basement lab with ambient temp around 58F, the device not being in an enclosure tries to raise his basement temp and for the surface temp to reach a specific temp would take more energy than if the surroundings were say 78F, so how would one go about calibration? Can you begin to see why it is isolated in a well insulated chamber?

In addition the chamber and all its components as well as the heat exchanger have some specific heat value which will distort you reading, one needs to place the circuit in the chamber and with a known input power record the temperature change in the water (1cal=1'C to make it easy and 1cal=4.187Joules) for a period of time until equilibrium is reached/ At this point the temp of the water will tell the amount of energy absorbed to get it there subtracted from the input, yields the heat in the other components. This is the offset. Now you run the circuit (without changing anything, or you would have to recalibrate). You run the circuit, measure the water temp and using the input and the calibration offset, determine the amount of energy given off by the circuit.

[DrStiffler]

@Pirate88179

I forgot to say this in my last answer to you.

I'm not having problems per say with the calorimetry, the problem if we would call it that is that the circuit has shown factors of <1 to >5 and it does decline as time moves on. The problem is that once its inside the chamber, one is not able to see if adjustment will correct the condition. If it were not that it would be a great bit of engineering I would like to have some kind of auto tuning control and a video camera in there, hell maybe (  ) the transistor is frosting up  . Although the chamber is not only insulated it is constructed to also be a Faraday Cage, there is so much RF inside that it was a real trick to get the active temp sensors to work properly in the chamber. Not to mention you don't want to run a bundle of wires from the circuit outside for measurement, anything hung on a SEC Exciter causes real problems and does not provide real time operational information.