Electrical Faux Pas

[poynt99]

hi Paul.

i was doing a comparison to your analogy of the light switch and power company. when i say "what it means to me", i am hopefully speaking for all free energy seekers/believers.

i do understand open systems, and anything other than a limitless (or almost limitless) source of high power is of no interest to us right? i hope so anyway, otherwise why are we here at this forum 

"conventional" open systems are mostly divergent. as you say solar and geothermal are open (convergent) free energy systems, but i don't place them in the same class as ZPE, VPF, aether etc. do you?

so there is a technical and practical way of looking at open systems and COPs greater than 1. anyone can hang a solar cell out their window and collect free energy, but that's not what we're here for. solar energy is technically free energy, but it's too inefficient at the moment to put a real dent in things.

now if you can hang your TPU out the proverbial window and are able to produce a COP of 1000:1 from wherever this baby gets it's energy, well now you're talkin'!  that's practical free energy 

in the end all this terminology talk means very little. when we get our TPU's working we'll have tons more energy available than what our 9V can supply, and it will do this for as long as the darn thing lasts. i don't care all that much where the additional energy comes from, nor if i should be calling it free energy, overunity, COP>1, an open system, 100+% efficiency, or whatever.



Thanks

[Grumpy]

When we say "open system" - in what sense are we speaking of?

For example, an ordinary solenoid coil is closed electrically, but open magnetically - so it can be closed or open depending on the reference used.

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Getting to something more interesting, why is the "electric vector potential" not used in classical electrodynamics?  This precedes the magnetic field and the electric field.

F.F. Mende has some interesting thoughts and conclusions:

http://arxiv.org/ftp/physics/papers/0506/0506083.pdf

These four fundamental parameters ee0, mm0, Lk and Ck clarify the physical picture of the wave and resonance processes in material media in applied electromagnetic fields. Previously, only electromagnetic waves were thought to propagate and transfer energy in material media. It is clear now that the concept was not complete. In fact, magnetoelectrokinetic, or electromagnetopotential waves travel in material media. The resonances in these media also have specific features. Unlike closed planes with electromagnetic resonance and energy exchange between electric and magnetic fields, material media have two types of resonance ? electrokinetic and magnetopotential.  Under the electrokinetic resonance the energy of the electric field changes to kinetic energy. In the case of magnetopotential resonance the potential energy accumulated during the precessional motion can escape outside at the precession frequency.

Hmm - C_k (kinetic capacitance) has never been known to exists...interesting.

[pauldude000]

@Grumpy

By "open" and "closed" systems, we refer to a systems energy interactions with the surrounding environment. Any system is determinate of the energy available verses the work applied to the environment.

A "closed" system has a limited amount of energy, contained only within the system.

An "open" system assumes that there is an external energy source which cannot be depleted. (The external source is generally thought of as infinite, though it does not have to be.)

That is the definitions in a nutshell.

Concerning Mende.

I intend to read the pdf, as it looks interesting just from the quote. Thanks Grumpy.

Paul Andrulis

[Grumpy]

Paul

Forget about open or closed. 

Take a common spark gap in an "anomolous" device such as a Tesla Transformer.  By the way, Tesla state many times that he could obtain "any amount of energy" he desired from his transformer - hint hint.

Is the gap open or closed?  Doesn't matter.

It is not the spark gap itself that is responsible for the magnification effect. any more than the top load capacitance.  The important part is what the spark gap does.  It conducts within a couple of nanoseconds and with magnetic quenching, it quenches just as quickly - so you get a steep rise and a steep fall for your pulse.  This pulse combined with the coils of the system produces the effects.

See, Paul, the energy is already there.

[wattsup]

Before @zpe left the forum (hope he is doing good), he left us with a set of guidelines in order to determine if a device is producing OU or not. I am honored to upload his pdf document for any newer guys to mull over.

It is located here;
http://www.overunity.com/index.php?action=tpmod;dl=get94

I would classify open system as linear and closed system as looping.

Eventually, we will realize that Grumpy is right and that there is no open or closed. There will simply be "always has been" and "never knew it was there". If you dive in the ocean, you don't look to make open paddling and closed paddling. You just paddle and the water is always there.

But given the fact that life and humanity is in a progression of events and obviously we still have a ways to go before free energy becomes our daily reality, we still need some rules to go by and what @zpe had proposed seems to be almost correct. I say almost because I remember there were a few points that I myself did not agree with. But at least he put this in writing. Coming from a true EEer, who I sense did not have a total belief in free energy systems, for him to produce this document must have been difficult. Especially when he would see all of us continuously trying to plug our devices (or concoctions) into the wheel work of nature, only to see us blowing fuses. lol

@pauldude000

Thanks for your reply to my initial question. I will look into it. I used to come to this thread once in a while when I had some questions on regular EE stuff and I imagine I will do so again and again and again....................................... Beats opening a new thread any time you have a question.